nodropinufaka
Well-Known Member
Oh Boy. Lots to unpack here.
You are going to be extremely disappointed in Navy Intel.
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DCO/IWC Qualifications with STEM Background
- Thread starter Geobrass
- Start date
Oh Boy. Lots to unpack here.
You are going to be extremely disappointed in Navy Intel.
OP, I have to ask what your motivation to go Intel is vs IP or CW. I've been on the other side of the looking glass on these DCO boards and I've seen too many candidates list their pref for Intel only when they've got the qualifications and probably motivation for IP and CW. It seemed in many cases they just didn't know enough about IP and CW and gravitated towards Intel because of the name.
Your academic and work experience credentials are solid. However, you'll have to do well in your interviews as well; part of that is communicating your motivation to be an Intel/IP/CW officer and your noted leadership experience.
Your academic and work experience credentials are solid. However, you'll have to do well in your interviews as well; part of that is communicating your motivation to be an Intel/IP/CW officer and your noted leadership experience.
Folks, you will be Naval Officers first.
This said, you need to understand that you should be applying for and tailoring all elements of your application (essays, resume, etc.) to the designator for which you are most qualified. If you are most qualified for CW, then you need to smell like a CW and ooze it out of every orifice.
Get in the door first. You can always shuffle around later, however, I strongly suggest you make no mention of this to anyone, especially during the DCO application/interview process.
This said, you need to understand that you should be applying for and tailoring all elements of your application (essays, resume, etc.) to the designator for which you are most qualified. If you are most qualified for CW, then you need to smell like a CW and ooze it out of every orifice.
Get in the door first. You can always shuffle around later, however, I strongly suggest you make no mention of this to anyone, especially during the DCO application/interview process.
I agree with the shuffling around later in principle, but not in practice.
It took me 10 years of disapprovals before I finally got Navy to approve my redesignation request, and most of those years were painful and in a job I was deeply unhappy with. I imagine most would have resigned and discharged and not had the conviction to see it through. I left active duty and almost left the Reserve before I finally got the approval.
For what it's worth, many others were luckier and had an easy time redesignating. It also tends to be easier in the Reserve than on active duty since you only need to submit a request and don't need to convince a board that only meets semi-annually. YMMV...
Respectfully, for DIRCOM, between IP (1825) and CW (1815) it's not your choice - it's the Navy's choice. You can rank one above the other, but if you rank them #1/#2 the board will slot you where you're the best fit. Both require extensive cyber/IT/RF expertise, just slightly different flavors. When the board selects you, they give you one designator choice: take it or leave it. You can apply for only one designator if you want to be sure of what you get, but that also diminishes your chances, obviously.
In interviewing DCO's I see distinct differences between those selected for IP and those selected for CW. As an IP, we are nothing more than glorified IT and radio comms people.
The CW's I see being selected the last couple of years are much more hands-on technical people with hard technical/engineering experience and background (pen testers, reverse engineers, network engineers, etc.) needed for CW work.
100% agree. But many applicants throw in for both designators, and my point was that the board will place them where their skills fit best.
nodropinufaka
Well-Known Member
This is so comical to me.
Why does it require Cyber/IT/RF Expertise?
If kids from state schools with liberal arts degrees are commissioning in these designators on active duty why does the reserves hold such absurd qualifications?
exNavyOffRec
Well-Known Member
around 90% of those commissioning AD in IP and CW have tech degrees, the caveat would be those that are AD enlisted in IWC designators.
Because they can. There are other reasons, too, but it comes down to supply/demand.
These are disparate groups. Aside from both having to attend the same basic course, the AD side gets far more OJT and persistent exposure to their job function and other IWC Sailors in their community who they can learn from. Reserve DCOs will never get as much of the same experience, and need to bring more to the table to succeed when they do go on orders/MOB.
DCOs are also taken off the street whereas the bulk of AD officers come from long pipelines in NROTC and USNA. As Hair Warrior said, supply and demand.
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Marketing. If they make the qualifications absurd they will gain more applicants who think the programs are more prestigious.
Why is someone who speaks multiple languages a more desired Intel DCO applicant even though they will never use these language skills?
D
Deleted member 67144 scul
Guest
No one should look at ED without asking three times as many questions as they would for any other designator. Reserve ED is a unique program and comes with some surprises if you don't ask all the right questions beforehand. CEC is a viable path for OP too, and would likely be preferable.
What hurts this arbitrariness is recruiters I dealt with several years back didn't have a clue what's going on. Since many Reserve IP and CW picks are IT security people, the recruiters were telling me and others that one needs to be an IT security person to be competitive. At the time, as a software engineering lead whose work included developing services that prevent abusive users on a platform used by hundreds of millions of people, I thought I would be a good pick. However, the recruiters reiterated that "IT security" experience and having IT security certifications, which are worthless in my field, were key so I backed off.
After my commissioning, I was hearing how generic software developers were getting picked up for IP and CW, so the egg's on my face. ?
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exNavyOffRec
Well-Known Member
FYI, the info that the recruiters were given in order to look for candidates comes directly from those IWC reserve officers doing the panel interviews, not saying that some recruiters go rogue, but the direction comes from within your own community.
I respectfully disagree. I don’t think the marketing is very good, to be honest - Big Reserves isn’t out their buying web ads or tv commercials.
I think it’s still supply and demand. The Navy Reserve has BY FAR the greatest number of officer designators available for direct commission (IWC, CEC, Supply, PAO, HR, AEDO/AMDO, EDO, Strat Sealift), and BY FAR the oldest age limit without a waiver (42). Go ask the Air Force if they’ll give you a direct commission at age 41.5 to be a Strategic Airlift Officer and they’ll laugh you out the door.
There is a perception (not entirely wrong) that - if you have the right connections - you can just waltz in the door to whatever “cool” military job sounds good on a resume, get a commission, breeze through DCO (now ODS), and moonlight for one weekend a month. That’s a false perception of what the Navy truly needs in its reserve officer corps, but I didn’t come up with that perception and it’s been there for years. There are plenty of famous political names. George P Bush. Pete Buttigieg. Reince Priebus. Sean Spicer. Hunter Biden. Jimmy Panetta. There are others I’m sure. (If we’re keeping count: they are 2 PAOs, 1 HR, 3 Intel, 3 Democrats, 3 Republicans). Maybe “foreign language” is just a way of weeding out the Beltway bandits, or at least making sure some DCO Intel selects have cultural experience outside the United States.
Look, I’m a non-prior-service DCO too, so I am standing squarely in this glass house with stone in hand. But compared to the Army, Air Force, and Marines, that perception combo of 1) easy to get in, 2) no 10+ week OCS where you have to start as a CANDIO and possibly not make it, 3) better “MOS”/designator selection for DCO than just JAG and Medical, and 4) age limit 42, and the demand for joining is going to be through the roof bc people either aren’t eligible or don’t want to go reserve officer in the Army, Air Force, or Marines.
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