The End of the Officers Club

[TurnandBurn55]

Those of us who care, do what we can...

At the end of the day, I'd love to hear concrete suggestions other than accusations about "waiting for retirement"...

 

[A4sForever]

Those of us who care, do what we can...

At the end of the day, I'd love to hear concrete suggestions other than accusations about "waiting for retirement"...

Why argue?? But since you asked .... why do you want ME to tell YOU how to save YOUR O'Clubs .... ??? I'm out. I did my part when I was 'in'.

I just call 'em as I see 'em ... and I see a crushing lack of military leadership that is willing to take on military/civilian 'upper management' (at the risk of their 'career') for the good of the Officer Corps and to save American military traditions. That sorry situation has been developing & been patently obvious for the past 15+ years to anyone w/ any intellectual honesty. Do you expect me to reverse a decade & a half of caving in to the Tailhook '91 witch hunt w/ the resultant PC in the military??? I don't think so ...

If a Nimitz or a Halsey had been running the Navy during the Tailhook aftermath .. it would have been O-V-E-R in a couple of months ... and not still a millstone hanging around our (your) necks 18 years later ....

When I didn't like the direction MY Navy was taking ... I voted w/ my feet instead of bitching about how things were and stumbling around for fixes and 'concrete suggestions' from someone else ... and most of my contemporaries voted the same way.

If you don't like my observation(s):

Keep going to your sorry 'all hand's' clubs ... or go to town.

Or ...

Why don't YOU tell us what the answer is, since you state that '(you) care' and 'do what (you) can' ... ??? You know; since you are one of the ones that will have to change the PC culture of the past decade + ... ??? I do know one thing from civilian politics and special interest agendas ... you HAVE to get organized and numbers DO count. Witness the Aviation Greens petition. Numbers & organization: it's usually the ONLY things that will move those 'in charge' to consider the 'benefits' of going in another direction.

United you stand, divided you fall and all that happy horseshit ... but it actually works.

I'm listening ...

 

[Bjammin]

One of the problems is that in the good ole' days not anywhere near as many SNA's or JO's were married with kids. There was a time when SNA's were required to live on base. That meant many more good O' club nights. Now with more families in the JO ranks, MWR budget cuts, and PC after tailhook we have a perfect storm for the clubs to suffer.

I think Kinngsville club is actually OK. They have beer from 3 to 7 (or longer if they have business) on Wed, Thur, and Fri. I had my O-5 wetting down while a couple of guys got wingned there a couple of weeks ago and we all had a BLAST. Lots of crazy dancing, some good local "talent", and CHEEP booze. The duty driver was made available to get people home and both the base CO and Commodore stayed way late.

If the students can take just a piece of that back to their fleet squadrons, maybe along with some of senior leadership, they can get some of that "esprit de corps" back into the clubs.

 

[MasterBates]

And Krock has what most clubs don't..

A Katapult and an MWR director who gives a shit.

 

[Carlos Caliente]

The Jacksonville O-Club isn't even open anymore. Unless you book it for a special occasion, which really means it's no longer an O-Club.

True, which is why we spent every thursday afternoon at the T-bar. Hopefully it's still going.

 

[BACONATOR]

A lot of it also has to do with the ridiculous overboard 0 tolerance alcohol policies on base these days. It's gotten to the point where if you get stopped by base police walking home drunk and they write a report with your name and alcohol together, you're screwed.

People just don't see the point in risking drinking on base when they can go out in town and drink and not have to worry about it at all. (I'm not talking about dudes who go get blackout drunk in town and get belligerent. Those guys have a lot to worry about. I'm talking about responsible, albeit heavy, drinking). Anything that is officially recorded with your name and alcohol in the report is an "alcohol incident", even if it's walking home drunk, pulled over after having ONE beer 45 minutes ago, or some dude punches you in the face because he thought you were looking at his girl and you were drinking quietly with your friends in a bar.

ALL those circumstances end up being "your fault" because of Navy policy.

 

[Ducky]

A lot of it also has to do with the ridiculous overboard 0 tolerance alcohol policies on base these days. It's gotten to the point where if you get stopped by base police walking home drunk and they write a report with your name and alcohol together, you're screwed.

People just don't see the point in risking drinking on base when they can go out in town and drink and not have to worry about it at all. (I'm not talking about dudes who go get blackout drunk in town and get belligerent. Those guys have a lot to worry about. I'm talking about responsible, albeit heavy, drinking). Anything that is officially recorded with your name and alcohol in the report is an "alcohol incident", even if it's walking home drunk, pulled over after having ONE beer 45 minutes ago, or some dude punches you in the face because he thought you were looking at his girl and you were drinking quietly with your friends in a bar.

ALL those circumstances end up being "your fault" because of Navy policy.

As much as I agree with what you said above, I must give props to the North Island MPs who ensured that 2 fellow shipmates and myself had a ride back to our Q room after the cab dropped us off at the front gate and we walked around lost and intoxicated for about 30 min. So there is a silver lining in a black cloud.

To the more senior crowd, what can young O-1s and O-2s do to help revive old traditions. After all our fitreps do say NOB :icon_smil.

 

[statesman]

To the more senior crowd, what can young O-1s and O-2s do to help revive old traditions. After all our fitreps do say NOB :icon_smil.

Actually go to the NASP O Club when you are down here visiting your fiancee...

I did hear you eventually made it out there the one weekend I was out of town.

 

[SDNalgene]

The K-Rock club was always a good time for winging parties and the like. I think the main reason is that a majority of the heavies would show up and drink with the JOs (occasionally out-drink). As an indication of both what is right and what is wrong with K-rock, the club wasn't open for New Years (a bunch of us had to fly the next day to make a det, so we had a legitimate reason to not be drunk in Austin). Undeterred we had our own party at the pseudo-base housing community room and all three O-6s from K-rock showed up with their wives and stayed until well after 2 am. There's still a long way to go, but thanks to a commodore and a squadron CO who cared about our club and one goofy helo to E2 transition JO (I hear he took the DH bonus) the club was on a solid improving trend. To the hinges and above, while some will still be scared off, if you can make us feel safe professionally and allow it to be socially productive (ladies nights) we will definitely show up to the clubs in force. If you don't, we will all go elsewhere to drink and fornicate worry free.

 

[AJTranny]

From what I have noticed so far, the team building and the like has left the oclubs as stated and moved to the individual squadrons. The JOPA now has the responsibility to either make or break their squadron's social readiness. It's not a surprise that the weak JOPAs have weak squadrons while the strong JOPAs find a way to have a blast and kick butt in the air. It's obviously regrettable the oclub tradition has lost something but it's the JOs that make this business way better than chugging from the corporate co&k. While we should fight to take back the oclubs and it's traditions, in the end, it's just a building and should have no bearing on team spirit. Just green light your skipper and "drag" him to the nudy bar. There's something about watching a hinge (or higher) pay for a local's tuition that makes you glad you're in this line of work.

 

[Afterburner76]

This is a great article and a great discussion. Mods, can we move to a "non-private" forum so that others can read as well?

 

[HeyJoe]

This is a great article and a great discussion. Mods, can we move to a "non-private" forum so that others can read as well?

Done

 

[Swanee]

I passed the article around my platoon when I got the Gazette last month. We are trying, but it seems that too many of our peers are too afraid to cut loose for fear of being seriously punished.

Something has to change, too many guys are sitting in their rooms on a Friday or Saturday night doing nothing, or even worse, studying...

 

[Never_Fits]

I have never felt more welcome in a group then when hanging out and drinking with a fellow group of aviators at an O-Club or squadron bar. Flight suit fridays is still alive at NAS Pensacola, but i have seen decline elsewhere. This O-1 will not let it die.

I take this charge with great pride and vigor. I will strive to do everything in my power as the future of naval aviation (at least thats what all the doors i seem to walk through try and tell me) to continue the traditions and customs that have brought us this far. Step 1: get wings. Step 2: Revive O-Clubs.

 

[usmarinemike]

An obstacle from the Marine side....

Here at MATSG the XO is plugging the plans of a local wealthy dude for a replacement of Trader Jon's. The XO is a pretty awesome guy so we all respect what he has to say. After all, Trader Jon's is another huge tradition here in P-Cola. Anyway, we were having our daily 2ndLt gaggle formation earlier in the week, and as we were discussing our planned O-Call at the future location of this new bar, our OIC (a major, came through the Fleet Accession Program from arty, seems like a good man) said something very closely to the effect of "The O Clubs are dead...We need to find elsewhere to go to have fun. We have the opportunity to make this our own."

Wow...Write off about 200 O-1s (the same guys I got trashed with at the Hawk) from ever wanting to go into an O Club ever again. I understand he wants to support the new place, but damn.