• Please take a moment and update your account profile. If you have an updated account profile with basic information on why you are on Air Warriors it will help other people respond to your posts. How do you update your profile you ask?

    Go here:

    Edit Account Details and Profile

NSW Standardizing on Glock 19

insanebikerboy said:
SOCOM wants the two squadrons and had future budgets POMd to fund them. Unfortunately it's not quite so simple to make a non-SOF entity fall under the SOCOM as one would think. Also, there was some serious rice-bowl protection going on and no one realized just how severe the loss would be till the order came out to shutdown 84/85 and the loss of support was felt for real...
Click to expand...

I am familiar with how hard budgeting can be but I am still baffled as to why it took SOCOM so long to do that if it is such a valuable asset. To me that says they didn't value it as highly as they claim. Again, an outsiders view but 84/85 definitely seem the odd men out to everyone to their detriment.
 
There's also the long tail of engineering resources at navair for what is/was a one off airframe in the -H. Not a reason that cannot be overcome, but something the Navy thinks about.
 
Flash said:
I am familiar with how hard budgeting can be but I am still baffled as to why it took SOCOM so long to do that if it is such a valuable asset. To me that says they didn't value it as highly as they claim. Again, an outsiders view but 84/85 definitely seem the odd men out to everyone to their detriment.
Click to expand...

The best way I can explain it is due to the flavor of money. The operating budgets were mainly sourced inside the Navy budget via OCO funds, which for years wasn't an issue for SOCOM or the Navy. When budgets and OCO funds started going away the Navy was looking to save money and 84/85 was an easy answer for them. By the time SOCOM realized this they started planning for 84/85 in the POM cycle but the Navy wouldn't extend the timeline.

The interim posed some money/funding issues for SOCOM since 84/85 aren't SOF per the legal U.S.C. definition. On top of that, entities inside SOCOM said that they could take up the slack if 84/85 went away. Big Navy also said that regular Navy helos could make up the difference. Both aren't true and no one up high truly realized what was being lost till the customers started bitching about lack of support.

My opinion is the Navy tried to save face by not fully rescinding the shutdown order by still closing 84 and creating the TSU idea. 85 was lucky to be the one staying open and my hope is in a year or two the TSUs are not what was expected and 84 will be reopened.
 
Last edited:
insanebikerboy said:
in a year or two the TSUs are not what was expected and 84 will be reopened.
Click to expand...
What was it that Mark Twain said about history?

There are a number of other factors that provided sticking points - a/c transition, cost of SO-P mods, and care and feeding (eg who manages the FHP?).

Remember that NSW used to own the PC boats and they got burned in the care/feeding of those assets.
 
hscs said:
What was it that Mark Twain said about history?

There are a number of other factors that provided sticking points - a/c transition, cost of SO-P mods, and care and feeding (eg who manages the FHP?).

Remember that NSW used to own the PC boats and they got burned in the care/feeding of those assets.
Click to expand...

What is interesting is how the future is changing now that the LCS buy has been reduced. That may free up aircraft for a sooner than expected transition.
 
insanebikerboy said:
What is interesting is how the future is changing now that the LCS buy has been reduced. That may free up aircraft for a sooner than expected transition.
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure the last Sierra came off the line last year. Last I heard there were a dozen or so sitting in preservation in San Diego though. Or maybe you mean (smartly) making some squadrons smaller now that their mission doesn't exist?
 
ChuckMK23 said:
Why does their mission no longer exist..?
Click to expand...

My understanding is HSC(exp) was plussed up in size from HC to take on the OAMCM and ASU roles on the LCS as part of the "Helo Master Plan". Then LCS was late, now truncated, and the OAMCM kit is at least partially dead.
 
SynixMan said:
My understanding is HSC(exp) was plussed up in size from HC to take on the OAMCM and ASU roles on the LCS as part of the "Helo Master Plan". Then LCS was late, now truncated, and the OAMCM kit is at least partially dead.
Click to expand...

Yup, that's what I was thinking.
 
SynixMan said:
My understanding is HSC(exp) was plussed up in size from HC to take on the OAMCM and ASU roles on the LCS as part of the "Helo Master Plan". Then LCS was late, now truncated, and the OAMCM kit is at least partially dead.
Click to expand...
The parts of the OAMCM kit that have been canxd don't decrease the # of helos required.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top