Not when they're tax exempt. Now, if they would like to pay taxes like other businesses do, then I'm inclined to give them a lot of latitude in how they operate. As it is, they are nothing more than a tax payer subsidized entity. I have no skin in this game. I'm not an off duty cop, and I don't attend NFL games.
Well there is that. They get to have a beer with lunch while on duty. Let's see...beer-gun...beer-gun...beer-gun? Maybe it is better we don't have that option here.
You don't have to give a shit. I don't care in the sense that I don't go to NFL games or even watch much on TV. As to why they should be treated different than you regarding carry, they have a legal obligation to intervene if they witness a crime and they can be targeted by any number of dirt balls they have arrested. I think probably the only guys you have to worry about are few jealous husbands and boyfriends. And if you were careful, they are smaller than you or big wimps.
Not emotional. Also fail to see what is illogical about my opinion. I can not dispute your personal experiences working for Live Nation, but having been an attendee of many Live Nation events, I have not once seen a notice prohibiting off duty cops from carrying a weapon. That is my experience. I think the emotion is all on your part. Insisting that cops "go fvck themselves" because they might have a privilege you don't is a bit much. I suppose you wouldn't be offended if someone yelled at a military member in uniform "go fvck yourself" because they took advantage of an airline extending a privilege to them to pre board a flight. I'll get to the law later, but cops can carry guns lots of places ordinary citizens can't. I am all for more liberal carry for citizens. But when you can claim that you have royally pissed off in the course of your duties dozens, hundreds, of very violent people, many of whom swore revenge or threatened you, have been trained and retrained periodically in the tactical use of firearms to the level of law enforcement, will have your actions automatically reviewed for compliance with restrictive policy, and are constitutionally authorized to deny a person's civil rights, well then yes, I agree you should have the same rights of carry as a cop. Otherwise. it just ain't the same. As to the law, NavyOffRec spoke to it in part, and he knows something about it. The case you site does not refer to an individual officer's obligation to act. It is a key ruling because it really says THE POLICE can't be held liable for crimes they didn't prevent or stop they didn't know about. You can't sue your police department because you got robbed while the cops ate donuts and drank coffee three blocks away. Individual officers and sometimes agencies do get sued for not intervening when they know a crime is being committed and they are able to take action. I am personally aware of a law suit just like that. But that certainly depends on the state and local case law. In any case, as Spekkio said, it is about local laws and agency policy requiring action. A duty to intervene is pretty common. Remember the biker beat down in New York? Officer that was there and witnessed it is in hot water because he didn't act. Yes cops get drunk and do stupid things. Sometimes even at Live Nation events and NFL games. Can't recall a time they shot up the place though. I support private business owners having the right to set their own rules. I just don't see the logic in this case. In the end I seem to respect Live Nation and the NFL's rights more than you support law enforcement only because of some juvenile envy over gun carry privileges. You want the same privileges, become a reserve law enforcement officer. Sounds like you might find it worth the time and effort just to carry on school grounds.
Not 'shot up the place,' but I can provide multiple examples in the last 12 months where off-duty cops decided to carry firearms while out for a brew (in a state that forbids concealed carry for us normal peasants), got beer muscles, started a fight, and ended up shooting someone. Bonus is one was covered up by the precinct -- well, they attempted to.
I am going to have to respectfully request to see some support for this assertion. Of course it happens. But really, multiple in the last year? First some clarity. By multiple if you mean two, maybe three, well then ok, I might buy that. Given the scope of this discussion I am not interested in the cop that shoots the dude in bed with his wife or even plans a murder for whatever reason. Clearly that has noting to do with off duty carry in public venues. Also not willing to accept off duty interventions of a crime that is disputed by plaintiffs lawyers claiming excess force. Anyone can bring suit for that. Let's keep it to the type of scenario you outline above and is clearly something the NFL is worried about. Not trying to be a jerk. I am honestly interested. I try to keep tabs on this sort of thing. I just don't see the numbers being anything close to a national problem. Whatever the number, I am quite sure it is far less than the number of legit interventions in criminal activity by off duty officers. So why not let them keep the tools to do their job when off the clock and not paid a cent of taxpayer's money.
I can think of 3 off the top of my head. I'll dig up links later if you really want them, but since you say you 'buy it,' is it that hard to believe that a young 20-something with a new-found $60,000/year salary who now thinks he's hot-shit and 'professional courtesy' backing him up would misbehave while out for a night, that alcohol inhibits decisionmaking ability, and that putting the two together led to a confrontation that shouldn't have happened? Especially when THESE GUYS are now the ones on the police force?
Quite impossible to prove as these instances don't get printed in the news as fervently as when an off-duty cop does something illegal and seriously hurts or kills someone for it.
Yep, I'm not talking about any of that, either.
Not at 98% of the law enforcement agencies in this country!!!!! Cops don't get a superior sense of morality just for completing the academy. But unlike most other employment the screening process does a pretty darn good job of excluding individuals with a warped sense of morality or questionable ability to follow the rules. As to decsion making, any LE academy I am aware of does teach advanced decision making as making judgments is a large part of the job. That includes not drinking when armed or waving your gun around in public. Even the vast majority of the less than professional tough guy cops limit it to verbal abuse and pompous attitude.
