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New GI Bill
- Thread starter S.O.B.
- Start date
I was thinking the same thing, where is the money going to come from?
Exactly. What a deal: you pay in a grand and get 80 back! Even if you don't want to go to school you can get out, take 12 credits at a JUCO and collect the cash. This is retarded.
It won't effect retention. Com'on. The Montgomery GI Bill is a pretty good deal, and it doesn't effect retention appreciably. Almost nobody says "Hell yeah, I'm gettin' out so I can go to college for free." They get out and go to work to support their family. If they happen to get some time for school, then they might use it. The new bill might have an effect initially because of all of the hoopla, but once everything settles down, people are going to have the same ambivalent attitude toward it as they have now. A staggeringly small percentage of 1-termers don't use their GI Bill benefits now. Just because the number at the bottom of the page is bigger doesn't mean that many more people are going to use it. A larger percentage than most people think of the best and brightest enlisted guys just don't want to go to school, as well. I don't pretend to know why, but it is true.
And saying that someone who joins for the college benefits likely won't make the best troop is wrong. Even someone who wants a free ride through college knows what duty and honor are. Those who know the value of an education are also likely to be more apt to grow where they're planted. That's all I will say about that.
Some of you act as if the sky is falling. I'd be scheduling time with the troops to spell out the new benefits.
And saying that someone who joins for the college benefits likely won't make the best troop is wrong. Even someone who wants a free ride through college knows what duty and honor are. Those who know the value of an education are also likely to be more apt to grow where they're planted. That's all I will say about that.
Some of you act as if the sky is falling. I'd be scheduling time with the troops to spell out the new benefits.
That's because before now that wouldn't have been true.
Most people believe it to be true. COnventional Wisdom is that GI Bill pays for college...period. I have a feeling that when knowledges of the new iteration makes its way through the ranks, there will be a lot of blank stares that say, "Isn't that what the GI Bill already did? Oh, okay. I'm gonna go play my 360 now."
That's the sorry GI Bill I enlisted under.
College wasn't even close to being paid for me. How the times have changed.
I agree with Mike here. I really don't think this will affect retention at all. I've had many Sailors get out over the years and most of them were just because the Navy wasn't for them. I can only remember two of my guys, out of a couple dozen, that were actually serious about going back to school. On top of that, there was only one of those guys that I actually tried to convince to stay in. The rest were guys that I could stand to lose. My point is, the great Sailors are going to stay in regardless of how much college money they'll get when they get out. If the leadership is taking care of their Sailors, they'll continue to re-enlist.
Well, I don't see how it will improve retention in any case. If the program is meant to increase recruiting there are other more targeted tools. Recruiting success is largely a function of the nation's economic situation at any given time and the military challenge a potential recruit will face, ie wars. This program will be in effect during easy recruiting years as well as tough. Even if the program improved recruiting why have a program that rewards guys that sign up to be medical technologists, MPs, veterinary assistants, air traffic controllers, and other specialties we have no trouble recruiting for, equally with the guys that sign up for Infantry, Motor T, and Bosun's Mate. If the program is meant to be a feel good measure because "they deserve it", then one has to ask what they deserve it for. Do our four year vets deserve this rich of a benefit at a cost that will compromise other programs or hurt retention? I suggest our junior Es don't deserve a gold plated college plan as much as more pay. The suggestion to tie sweetened veteran's benefits to gates, time in service, professional guals or sea duty is a good idea. The longer you serve, the more you contribute, the better your benefit. Even with all the previous vet programs I never understood how it was a guy that was a four year dirtball that barely rated an Honorable Discharge of any sort, including admin seps, got the same benefits as a 10 year vet that made E-6 and went to sea 5 or 6 times. When awarding veteran's benefits one has to ask what kind of service is the guy a veteran of? We make that distinction with dishonorable discharges, so why not extend it to premium benefits for those we retain and rely on to really make our military the best in the world. Oh, and we can't afford to give this gold plated benefit to everyone anyway. So target it to specifically improve retention and guys that enlist for the grunt jobs.
I've got to say that is a very sound and seemingly thought out plan you just laid out. Now if you could put that into politician speak so the ones in Washington could understand that it should be merit-based maybe they'd do it. But then parents would probably raise hell when their little boy who was lazy didn't get squat after he bailed for four years after being a turd. "But he was such a good kid, why didn't he get what that guy over there got?"
I like your plan. I really do. But it sounds idealistic and I just don't ever see ideal things happening in Washington.
I like your plan. I really do. But it sounds idealistic and I just don't ever see ideal things happening in Washington.
It's not even that.
It's that the Federal Government is committing itself to pay out money that it does not have.
It's bad enough that we're funding a war on our Chase-Manhattan Visa, but Congress has done the same with programs like the Prescription Drug bill from a couple years ago. Now we have this. Yet another charge on the Visa and no way in sight to ever hope to pay it back.
Legislation like this looks good to people who think that Federal money grows on trees.
Agreed. It is a feel good measure. It makes the public feel better about all the military has had to invest in the last 6 or 7 years. It makes the politicians look good and for those that regret their vote for war, they see this as absolution. Politicians that are against the war will look to this as just another cost of the war to bludgeon the administration with. As written, it is bad policy on more then one level.
I don't remember the exact numbers, but for me it worked out better to use it on active duty. A college course at extended campus took less time than a course at the main campus, so the rotation of funds would come around quicker. I can't remember what the yearly cap on TA was, but I could rotate separately between GI Bill, TA, and Florida Resident Agreement (FRAG) to pay for college. If I got out and just used GI Bill it would not have come close to covering the costs. My GI Bill Payed about $1000 a semester which was somewhere around 8 or 9 weeks at extended campus. I think we also have to remember that not everyone really wants to attend college, and some people would like their GI Bill to pay for other educational programs, Flight Training, Technical Schools etc...
Good news for us USNA and ROTC folks!!
as per http://education.military.com/money-for-school/gi-bill/new-gi-bill-overview#2
I don't remember the exact numbers, but the GI bill with the kicker is right around 1,300 a month. So if you only got paid 1000 for every 9 weeks, you are at a net loss of > $1,600, and you have 2 months of the GI bill deducted from your 36. I just don't see where you are coming from.