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Naval Aviations "One" Problem...

Brett327

Brett327

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Super Moderator
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dcushman13 said:
Well, of course my community isn't having trouble getting people to take orders there: there aren't any orders to take.

Last I checked, the ADHRB isn't a location incentive pay. Even the relatively nice locations of Jax and Whidbey aren't keeping pilots and NFOs in. JO retention is a nightmare right now and there's even folks getting out after screening for DH.
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You should really read the NAVADMIN.
 
DanMa1156

DanMa1156

Is it baseball season yet?
pilot
Contributor
sevenhelmet said:
Depends on the squadron- my findings are very different from yours. On the whole, my wife and I had some pretty good experiences with squadron officer spouse groups / FRG, and that part of the culture still seemed fairly intact when I left AD around 4 years ago.
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Same. We had squadron meal trains for all of our kids. My Jo squadron had a really tight spouses’ club.
 
gparks1989

gparks1989

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pilot
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Brett327 said:
I think the key factor is being in a small town/rural environment. Setting aside the professions that we normally think of as transportable, like teachers, nurses, etc., If you're a lawyer, or doctor, academic, engineer, scientist, businessperson in any of the traditional fleet concentration areas like JAX, Norfolk, San Diego, PAX, DC, even Oahu and Point Mugu, you're going to have a pretty good shot at finding employment. On the other hand, Whidbey, Bremerton, Lemoore, all the southern tier TRACOMs, Kauai, Fallon, China Lake, Key West, etc... that's going to be a challenge.

There's no way the service can offset that in any meaningful way. It's just going to have to be the cost of doing business, which includes locality pay.
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I was actually pleasantly surprised at how many professional opportunities were available for spouses in Whidbey. It often involved trips to Seattle, but the proximity of that city helped immensely. The problem with places like Lemoore or Fallon is they are close to large towns (or biggest little cities if you will) that don't have added pull. But yes you're right. The Navy has chosen these locations and they are stuck with them. Realistically, there is very little they can do to move the needle.

As an aside, I think my wife would happily give up work if we lived in Kauai....
 
DanMa1156

DanMa1156

Is it baseball season yet?
pilot
Contributor
Odominable said:
I think this is one of those things where it’s really just a luck of the draw/YMMV deal. I had the same experience but I had buddies in the squadrons next door who basically only hung out outside work at mando fun events.
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I believe it but in 3 squadrons that hasn’t been my experience. I’ve also made my share of ziti and lasagna and slow cooked meals for people in those squadrons too. I like that “small town community” feeling.
 
Flash

Flash

SEVAL/ECMO
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Super Moderator
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Odominable said:
I think this is one of those things where it’s really just a luck of the draw/YMMV deal. I had the same experience but I had buddies in the squadrons next door who basically only hung out outside work at mando fun events.
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I was in two squadrons, both were very different when it came to socializing outside work. The first was really good, very big with regular social events out in town (Green Lights were a semi-regular occurrence) and enthusiastic participation on the part of the wives and family, and almost everyone could find at least a few good friends in the squadron. The second was good to start but soon got a bit 'awkward' as one set of folks left, then started to get good again when a newer set came in before we were decommed.

As with many things it just depends, with timing playing a big factor.
 
taxi1

taxi1

Well-Known Member
pilot
There's probably a business opportunity in Lemoore to set up a remote work site with decent spaces, high speed internet, and good video conferencing capability that workers could lease to do remote jobs. Throw in a daycare next door?
 
ChuckMK23

ChuckMK23

FERS and TSP contributor!
pilot
taxi1 said:
There's probably a business opportunity in Lemoore to set up a remote work site with decent spaces, high speed internet, and good video conferencing capability that workers could lease to do remote jobs. Throw in a daycare next door?
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Or, even better, a development project similar to what California Forever is doing in Solano County, CA. The project is amazing and the Travis AFB community will benefit enormously.

I think the California Forever CEO Jans Sramek is brilliant. He's beating the NIMBYs hard!
 
AllAmerican75

AllAmerican75

FUBIJAR
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Brett327 said:
In your view, how is the Navy's stance different today than, say, 30 years ago?
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I don't think the Navy's message is any different but society has changed drastically and the Navy has not kept up. You now have spouses of both genders, you have spouses with far more professional/white collar jobs, and cost of living is such that you almost need both spouses to work full time in order to afford to live in certain high cost-of-living areas. I've always gotten the impression that when it comes to family, the Navy expects me to have a wife at home to deal with anything related to my home, my kid, or my personal life. Sadly, that's just not the case anymore for most officers or enlisted. Hell, it prompted me to leave AD as I realized that I could no longer fulfill both my responsibilities as an officer and my responsibilities as father at the same time.

MGoBrew11 said:
And to be fair to you, yes I think that culture is pretty dead in the Navy writ large. We get it through our church. Many of them are also Navy families, but it isn’t through the squadron or anything.
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It's definitely dead on the Surface and Submarine communities. The closest I had was when I was on shore duty but even that wasn't all the time as there was a stark divide between those officers who were single, married, and married with kids. The mindset of people wanting to associate outside of work seemed to die out with the shutting down of the officers' clubs and deglamorization of alcohol.
 
DanMa1156

DanMa1156

Is it baseball season yet?
pilot
Contributor
AllAmerican75 said:
I don't think the Navy's message is any different but society has changed drastically and the Navy has not kept up. You now have spouses of both genders, you have spouses with far more professional/white collar jobs, and cost of living is such that you almost need both spouses to work full time in order to afford to live in certain high cost-of-living areas. I've always gotten the impression that when it comes to family, the Navy expects me to have a wife at home to deal with anything related to my home, my kid, or my personal life. Sadly, that's just not the case anymore for most officers or enlisted. Hell, it prompted me to leave AD as I realized that I could no longer fulfill both my responsibilities as an officer and my responsibilities as father at the same time.


It's definitely dead on the Surface and Submarine communities. The closest I had was when I was on shore duty but even that wasn't all the time as there was a stark divide between those officers who were single, married, and married with kids. The mindset of people wanting to associate outside of work seemed to die out with the shutting down of the officers' clubs and deglamorization of alcohol.
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I've only seen this at one command I've been at, also my first shore duty, and I think largely because we were all flying 10 hour days but not with each other... everyone ended up hanging out with their old squadron mates for the most part.

But every other command I've been at - 2 other squadrons and 2 other staffs have been lively in getting together socially after (or in one case, before!) work.
 
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