That I may better serve the fleet, what pet peeves and annoyances do pilots have from the HCOs during exercises on smaller platforms (DDGs, CGs, etc).
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Helicopter Control Officer (HCO) Suggestion Box
- Thread starter BackOrdered
- Start date
Not running the problem yourself. You know we're going to ask for numbers, so have them ready and give them to us. If the bridge can't figure out the winds/course, be proactive and let the helo know they're still figuring it out. At least the helo knows that you know you're trying to get them what they need.
Also, as a former West Coast guy...a pet peeve of mine: FC does not equal BRC. Give the crew BRC. It's what the pub says to give us and it's what we fly in the aircraft. With a big magvar, it does make a difference, especially on a FLT I w/ the off-set approach.
Oh, and if you have box lunches, make sure they don't consist of pasta, rice, and or any soupy substance.
Also, as a former West Coast guy...a pet peeve of mine: FC does not equal BRC. Give the crew BRC. It's what the pub says to give us and it's what we fly in the aircraft. With a big magvar, it does make a difference, especially on a FLT I w/ the off-set approach.
Oh, and if you have box lunches, make sure they don't consist of pasta, rice, and or any soupy substance.
MasterBates
Well-Known Member
If you have an embarked HSL det, and Deck/Paddles asks for something, like "up a click on the lineup" "turn down the dustpans" or the pilot asks "steady on the lineups"
DO IT. No arguing. No overthinking. Just do it.
Also, be aware that doing a RA or EMCON recovery, the LSO will be switching deck status colors on the lights.
That's a no-radio comm to the helo crew, NOT the LSO thinking we are at another deck status.
Ask to see the LSO checklist in the shack, if you have one, it will help eliminate much confusion.
Oh, and turn the SGSI on EARLY so it's actually up and stable, along with the HARS bar.
DO IT. No arguing. No overthinking. Just do it.
Also, be aware that doing a RA or EMCON recovery, the LSO will be switching deck status colors on the lights.
That's a no-radio comm to the helo crew, NOT the LSO thinking we are at another deck status.
Ask to see the LSO checklist in the shack, if you have one, it will help eliminate much confusion.
Oh, and turn the SGSI on EARLY so it's actually up and stable, along with the HARS bar.
" "
... and please bother to actually read and understand the 00-80T-122 (not the entire 600 pages cover to cover, the pertinent chapters and sections should make themselves obvious).
Better yet if you have an embarked det then corner one of the pilots and straight up ask him/her to walk you through everything. They'll love you for it.
... and please bother to actually read and understand the 00-80T-122 (not the entire 600 pages cover to cover, the pertinent chapters and sections should make themselves obvious).
Better yet if you have an embarked det then corner one of the pilots and straight up ask him/her to walk you through everything. They'll love you for it.
Mostly on DDGs with no LAMPS det:
Learn how to read and use the wind envelope. Nothing worse than waiting 15 minutes for flight quarters and then getting "Green deck winds Port XX/XX" when the winds are clearly out of limits. Note: there are day and night envelopes. Don't get them confused.
If the winds are out of limits, don't ask if I am willing to accept them. Have the OOD do whatever it takes to get legal winds. There are very few reasons why it would ever be acceptable.
The wind envelopes also have pitch and roll limits on them. Don't ignore these. On a flight I DDG they are very low and can be out in even at low sea states.
Know what lights are supposed to be on for NVG ops. Be able to quickly adjust lights as asked and not have turn every knob to find what the pilot is asking for. When doing NVG ops, make sure that the OOD understands that the mast lights are not turned on when passing a green deck.
While hovering over the deck ... "Wave-off ... We forgot to ask the Captain" is very annoying.
If you have a det on board, the LSO should be running the show. Spend time talking with the pilots about any questions you have.
Learn how to read and use the wind envelope. Nothing worse than waiting 15 minutes for flight quarters and then getting "Green deck winds Port XX/XX" when the winds are clearly out of limits. Note: there are day and night envelopes. Don't get them confused.
If the winds are out of limits, don't ask if I am willing to accept them. Have the OOD do whatever it takes to get legal winds. There are very few reasons why it would ever be acceptable.
The wind envelopes also have pitch and roll limits on them. Don't ignore these. On a flight I DDG they are very low and can be out in even at low sea states.
Know what lights are supposed to be on for NVG ops. Be able to quickly adjust lights as asked and not have turn every knob to find what the pilot is asking for. When doing NVG ops, make sure that the OOD understands that the mast lights are not turned on when passing a green deck.
While hovering over the deck ... "Wave-off ... We forgot to ask the Captain" is very annoying.
If you have a det on board, the LSO should be running the show. Spend time talking with the pilots about any questions you have.
MasterBates
Well-Known Member
Also, NEVER EVER EVER use waveoff lights during NVG OPS.
Just call for it on the radio.
Just call for it on the radio.
I haven't needed an HCO yet, but as someone who will in the near future thank you for asking that question... I hope you're not the only HCO who gives a crap.
This leads to another point... I've worked w/ proactive HCOs and ones that just sit up there like a bump on the log expecting the LSO to do everything. The HCO runs the deck. He's responsible for everything (FOD walkdown, muster, etc) up until he passes the deck to the LSO. Once the LSO has the deck, he'll run the show, but the HCO is still an active safety observer and it's always helpful when he catches something and lets the LSO (who may be busy watching the aircraft) know what's going on. All that said, should something bad happen on deck that requires DC, the LSO is going to hand back the deck like a hot potato and very possibly egress the shack, so keep up w/ what's going.
If the helos ask for the restricted maneuvering lights to be turned off, it's because we can't see the deck, not just for shits and grins...
During VERTREP, don't start breaking down loads on the deck until the it's full, lest some plastic get sucked into the rotors/engine.
Stay green deck until the chock and chain guys are out of the rotor arc when putting on chains. It'll keep rogue COs and OODs from radically maneuvering until we're secure to the deck. Most of the time.
During VERTREP, don't start breaking down loads on the deck until the it's full, lest some plastic get sucked into the rotors/engine.
Stay green deck until the chock and chain guys are out of the rotor arc when putting on chains. It'll keep rogue COs and OODs from radically maneuvering until we're secure to the deck. Most of the time.
Since the important points have been covered:
If the guy you are landing has flown for a couple of hours to pick up your medevac or drop off the part that you desperately need, have the box lunches ready before they ask.
Meatloaf and lasagna are very poor choices for box lunches.
If the guy you are landing has flown for a couple of hours to pick up your medevac or drop off the part that you desperately need, have the box lunches ready before they ask.
Meatloaf and lasagna are very poor choices for box lunches.
Kudos for asking ... we're glad that you care!
My input: If I can see the screws of the ship coming out of the water, then there is no way that pitch is within limits, regardless of what class of ship you are on. So, be respectful, and give us the actual numbers (i.e. pitch, roll, and winds). It's up to the HAC flying the aircraft to accept them or not. If you give us dishonest numbers, then we (and some of your deckhands) could end up hurt, and no one wants that.
There are many HCOs that do not report honestly (or perhaps don't know the instruments well enough to know how to read them) and it can end badly for everyone. Last year, we did a Helo Day for a ship that lied about the numbers all day because they wanted to get their ATG cert done. Guess what ... ATG found out!
My input: If I can see the screws of the ship coming out of the water, then there is no way that pitch is within limits, regardless of what class of ship you are on. So, be respectful, and give us the actual numbers (i.e. pitch, roll, and winds). It's up to the HAC flying the aircraft to accept them or not. If you give us dishonest numbers, then we (and some of your deckhands) could end up hurt, and no one wants that.
There are many HCOs that do not report honestly (or perhaps don't know the instruments well enough to know how to read them) and it can end badly for everyone. Last year, we did a Helo Day for a ship that lied about the numbers all day because they wanted to get their ATG cert done. Guess what ... ATG found out!
MasterBates
Well-Known Member
Yep.. I can tell Pitch 6 Roll 20 from Pitch 1 Roll 4.. Easily.
So telling me it's 1 and 4 when it's WAY more than that.. Shenanigans.
So telling me it's 1 and 4 when it's WAY more than that.. Shenanigans.
My biggest issues has always been when the deck is ready (which is understandable) but the HCO or 'control' doesn't give us any other info. If the ship is still setting flight quarters and it should take about 10 minutes tell us that.
If the ship is having trouble finding winds, tell us.
If the Captain is not on the bridge and you can't land us until he's there, tell us.
If you don't feel like giving us the exact reason, just give us a time estimate until a ready deck. At the end of that estimate, if you're still not ready, update us.
There is nothing worse than just flying around thinking that the ship has forgotten you. That happens enough on the carrier, I'd appreciate it if it didn't happen on every ship!!!
To follow up on box lunches: sandwiches are always great, pizza is good, fried chicken is good; basically any food that you can eat with your hands and not get crap all over you. Cookies are AWESOME!!
If the ship is having trouble finding winds, tell us.
If the Captain is not on the bridge and you can't land us until he's there, tell us.
If you don't feel like giving us the exact reason, just give us a time estimate until a ready deck. At the end of that estimate, if you're still not ready, update us.
There is nothing worse than just flying around thinking that the ship has forgotten you. That happens enough on the carrier, I'd appreciate it if it didn't happen on every ship!!!
To follow up on box lunches: sandwiches are always great, pizza is good, fried chicken is good; basically any food that you can eat with your hands and not get crap all over you. Cookies are AWESOME!!
Learn how to get the winds within limits (whiz wheel, mo board) and recommend a course to the bridge. The wind hunting circle makes your ship and CO look like an ass. A smart ship doesn't need to turn 360 to get the winds in.
It's been said, but know how to work your systems.
Wind and pitch and roll limits are just that, an AND, not an OR. They both have to be in.
Don't let your deck guys hook the rescue hoist to the deck when doing HIFR.
Ensure your flight deck crew is sharp. Getting the fuel hose out shouldn't take 30min. My guys are going to want to see a fuel sample. For chock and chains, everyone loves the hustle.
When it comes to box lunches, think like this: would i want to eat this in a moving car? If all else fails, be like Mom and send us a bunch of PB&Js, cookies, and some cokes. It's pretty much foolproof. If you give the mail helo bread on bread sandwhiches, don't be surprised if you don't see mail for a bit.
It's been said, but know how to work your systems.
Wind and pitch and roll limits are just that, an AND, not an OR. They both have to be in.
Don't let your deck guys hook the rescue hoist to the deck when doing HIFR.
Ensure your flight deck crew is sharp. Getting the fuel hose out shouldn't take 30min. My guys are going to want to see a fuel sample. For chock and chains, everyone loves the hustle.
When it comes to box lunches, think like this: would i want to eat this in a moving car? If all else fails, be like Mom and send us a bunch of PB&Js, cookies, and some cokes. It's pretty much foolproof. If you give the mail helo bread on bread sandwhiches, don't be surprised if you don't see mail for a bit.