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Are stories of the SWO community valid?
- Thread starter jameskalder
- Start date
Wow, for a minute there I thought you were talking about the P-3 community.
MasterBates
Well-Known Member
I thought it was HSL.. But we got to sleep there.
I think our community pushes the crew rest thing a lot more than it should. When OPSOs start trying to sea lawyer the crew rest rules for training flights you know your community has lost sight of the forest for the trees.
But hey, NATOPS does say that it is not a substitute for sound judgment. And we all know how sound our readiness system is...
Two observations:
Somewhat ironic, with all the negative comments about the SWO community (which seem to be fairly accurate, from my experience) in this thread, that several months ago when a midshipman who had wanted aviation didn't get it, he was basically told to stop whining. (Don't know if it was the same posters or not.)
Is part of the difference between the two communities that, as a group, the people in the SWO community are not as talented as the people in the aviation community? That seems like the elephant in the room no one wants to talk about.
Somewhat ironic, with all the negative comments about the SWO community (which seem to be fairly accurate, from my experience) in this thread, that several months ago when a midshipman who had wanted aviation didn't get it, he was basically told to stop whining. (Don't know if it was the same posters or not.)
Is part of the difference between the two communities that, as a group, the people in the SWO community are not as talented as the people in the aviation community? That seems like the elephant in the room no one wants to talk about.
And WTF is "talent" exactly?
Ill-defined, I suppose some combination of intelligence and ability to get things done.
Clearly there are exceptions in both communities. But from what I have seen, for people who are physically qualified, aviation tends to be a preferred choice over the surface community. That means that people who are ranked higher (whatever the "ranking" is based on) will tend towards aviation.
I think "not as talented" is a bit disingenuous but I do believe that there is a significant difference in the nature of a person who is attracted to Naval Air vs. the SWO/Sub community.
I work with several former bubbleheads and SWO types and it is amusing to watch them beat a dead horse long after they have all the information needed to make a decision. They seem very deliberate and slow moving in their thought process, whether that is their nature or the nurture of a career that moved at 15 knots I do not know.
Perhaps it even happens in those that went Naval Air. When I was in VT-10 they drafted three guys for jets. None of them survived the training track to VT-86. So were they incapable of adapting or simply unmotivated? Again I don't know but only one redesignated and that was to AMO and not SWO. The other two got out.
I don't think so. There's plenty of sharp SWOs out there. Just as a whole, the community expends a lot of energy with little forward momentum. I've know plenty of knucklehead pilots just like I've known plenty of knucklehead SWOs (divo and DH alike).
BlackBearHockey
go blue...
The people who I've seen commission into each community haven't been brighter than one another, but they are almost strikingly different. I have seen some wonderfully sharp MIDN head the SWO route, but they are very different than their aviation counterparts. There's a huge difference in someone who finds the bridge exciting vs. someone who watched Top Gun too many times. Not bad or good, just different.
I think what does it is that the SWO community catches all the people who want to do their five and dive. Again, not a bad thing, but if someone comes into NROTC and wants to spend the shortest amount of time in the Navy, they'll be heading SWO. Surely there are those who want their ratings and the Nukes who want the money/job outlook, but I don't think in the same numbers as the SWO community. I asked an ENS on my last cruise what she wanted to do in the Navy, her response was, "to get out of it." I've yet to hear that from anyone else.
I think what does it is that the SWO community catches all the people who want to do their five and dive. Again, not a bad thing, but if someone comes into NROTC and wants to spend the shortest amount of time in the Navy, they'll be heading SWO. Surely there are those who want their ratings and the Nukes who want the money/job outlook, but I don't think in the same numbers as the SWO community. I asked an ENS on my last cruise what she wanted to do in the Navy, her response was, "to get out of it." I've yet to hear that from anyone else.
dreambrat18
New Member
Ok guys just a few questions for you.
First off what are my chances of actually making SWO?
Just graduated college with a 3.0, ASTB score of 50, I'm 21, female, I've got some really great references from Army O6s.
Whats the verdict? I've read most of the posts and think that the high stress would be addictive but is there alot of political nonsense? I mean am I going to have to work with bunch of glory grabbers or people who actually care about their work?
These posts are very informative but seem to skirt right around that point...
First off what are my chances of actually making SWO?
Just graduated college with a 3.0, ASTB score of 50, I'm 21, female, I've got some really great references from Army O6s.
Whats the verdict? I've read most of the posts and think that the high stress would be addictive but is there alot of political nonsense? I mean am I going to have to work with bunch of glory grabbers or people who actually care about their work?
These posts are very informative but seem to skirt right around that point...
No way to answer that, really, since it depends more on the other candidates' qualifications and how you stack up. 3.0 from where? What was your major?
I've heard SWO life described as many things, but "addictive" isn't one of them. It's not the stress of "doing great things under pressure," like say, Naval Aviation, but the stress of "working for asshats doing mindless nonsense repeatedly far away from home under pressure."
I'm also not sure what you mean by "political nonsense" and "glory grabbers".
This is a great Naval Air resource and there are some SWO's and ex-SWO's here, but if SWO is your only interest, go to sailorbob.com. I hear we're all a bunch of asshole, late sleepin', Shoe-hatin' aviators here. :icon_wink
Where does "look, stab, stab" come from? Or is it just one of those things?
I guess you look so that someone ELSE doesn't stab YOU in the back while you're stabbing your intended target in the back. Though I admit I don't have much experience in this area. Thankfully. :icon_tong