AF enlisted aircrew wings and maintenance badge for OCS

[jmcquate]

My god.......who cares.........the people who work with know who you are, and what you can do. Do good work......and see where you get. If you don't like it, leave.

 

[jmcquate]

As to the OP, why bring attention to yourself at OCS by wearing AF stuff on a Navy uniform. Just get through and be a jackass Ensign.

 

[Flash]

Aviators are the only ones that get a "warfare pin" before they get to the fleet. Really not sure how one can be warfare qualified without any operational fleet experience in whatever platform they employ, be it a DDG, SSBN, P-3....but I don't make the rules. Basically, it would be like giving nukes a SWO pin or dolphins after they finished prototype training. As for SWO training or lack thereof....yeah, let's not go there. Personally I think the whole concept of a warfare device, regardless of community, is a bit silly.

That is a case where the Navy and it's current 'warfare qualification' scheme came into being many years after aviator wings and the qualifications to get them were created and established and the Navy, for several good reasons, has chosen not to change how Naval Aviator wings are awarded to conform with how more recent 'warfare' pins are awarded to include the SWO pin.

 

[Steve Wilkins]

That is a case where the Navy and it's current 'warfare qualification' scheme came into being many years after aviator wings and the qualifications to get them were created and established and the Navy, for several good reasons, has chosen not to change how Naval Aviator wings are awarded to conform with how more recent 'warfare' pins are awarded to include the SWO pin.

I don't disagree, but that has nothing to do with my point. Everyone seems to want to argue why things are they way they are. All irrelevant with respect to what a warfare pin is today....good or bad.

I was fortunate to experience many parts of the Navy during my career, both as a student and operationally. I came in under the nuke program as an electrician. I went through the pipeline, completed it and was offered a staff pickup gig. I declined because at the same time, I got picked up for BOOST. Fast forward a few years and I found myself in aviation training pipeline. I did well there too, but knew it wasn't for me. Next up: SWO Mecca for 6 months and then off to the ship. 1st tour on a CG and second tour on a CVN conducting combat ops in support of OIF, standing watch in CDC while working on my EOOW (fake) qual down with the nukes. I saw the good, bad, and ugly with regard to training, culture, and morale across several different communities and sub-communities.

In my opinion nuke training set the standard. It is simply the best training I personally received while in the Navy. Maybe I got more out of it than others, I don't know. But it is still the hardest damn thing I've ever had to complete. Naval Aviation training is phenomenal. It is the only thing I experienced in 14 years in the Navy that came close to replicating nuke training in the amount of information needing to be absorbed. I wholeheartedly believe you guys deserve your wings at the completion of your initial training. SWO training on the other hand, is absolutely pathetic and every SWO knows it. I've also been through TAO school and it too is nothing compared to aviation or nuke training. Not even close. The best training I received as a SWO was as a GLO. Almost zero difference between GLO training and the real thing, other than shooting live ordnance. The SWO community would serve itself well by mimicking both the nuke and aviation communities with regard to initial training.

Note: The above is my opinion only, based on my experience and observations of those around me during my career. Things may have changed, for better...or worse.

 

[Pags]

During my OOD process I was pretty shocked by how unorganized/standardized the OOD/SWO syllabus is. So much of it ws based on word of mouth, undocumented best practices, and a giant pile of random references that included bits of EOSS (even if the accepted loss of rudder control was done completely differently than EOSS said it should be done), Navy instructions, and USNI publications (the watch officers guide is considered the de facto source for standard orders to the helm). Sign offs are done backwards from my experience in Naval Aviation with the authority doing most of the talking while the student takes notes. There is zero class wide standardization and guidance from a RON, TYCOM, or CNSF. I'm still flabbergasted that administrative oversight isn't more involved in the standardization of class-wide maintenance and that things like OMMS configuration is left to the crew and that each shop/division is also essentially their own maintenance control with the ability to determin their own workload priorities and little to no maintenance record keeping. It was a weird world that often left me shaking my head.

 

[Spekkio]

In my opinion nuke training set the standard. It is simply the best training I personally received while in the Navy. Maybe I got more out of it than others, I don't know. But it is still the hardest damn thing I've ever had to complete.

Not sure how long ago you went through the pipeline, but throughput issues due to aging prototypes along with fleet manning challenges has lowered the bar during nuke training. The civilian utility job market has taken notice. I personally found it challenging from the sheer volume of information thrown at me being completely unfamiliar with any sort of standard Navy terminology and equipment, but I never felt like I was asked to do anything particularly difficult from the standpoint of potentially failing. Having said that, it was miles above the training for forward qualifications and the nukes on the boat are not afraid to uphold that high standard.

 

[exNavyOffRec]

Not sure how long ago you went through the pipeline, but throughput issues due to aging prototypes along with fleet manning challenges has lowered the bar during nuke training. The civilian utility job market has taken notice. I personally found it challenging from the sheer volume of information thrown at me being completely unfamiliar with any sort of standard Navy terminology and equipment, but I never felt like I was asked to do anything particularly difficult from the standpoint of potentially failing. Having said that, it was miles above the training for forward qualifications and the nukes on the boat are not afraid to uphold that high standard.

Prototype issues have caused some challenges as have "A" school and power school, and it is noticed, one of the biggest affects is that the majority of attrition years ago was at "A" school and power school, now it has shifted so the fleet is flushing more than they ever had, and it is harder to flush a guy once he or she has qualified at prototype, it also takes longer to adjust for losses.

That being said the overall quality of training is still better than most and since the problems are known they are or at least they were being addressed so corrections could be made, I still see civilian companies falling over themselves for nuke qualified officers and enlisted.