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31 things learned as a fighter pilot

Zilch

This...is...Caketown!
This is from nowhere, but I always wondered why the Marine Corps never picked up the A-10. It seems ideal: Specialized CAS platform, rough field capability, big weapons load, cheap and simple, tough as hell. To me that looks more like Marines aircraft than an Air Force one.
 

Lawman

Well-Known Member
None
This is from nowhere, but I always wondered why the Marine Corps never picked up the A-10. It seems ideal: Specialized CAS platform, rough field capability, big weapons load, cheap and simple, tough as hell. To me that looks more like Marines aircraft than an Air Force one.


There was a thread on this a while back. Basically the concensus was the A-10 didnt fit the Amphib/Expeditionary mindset of the time as well as the Harrier did. Not to mention that the A-10 has a lot of interesting problems when stacked against the current crop of aircraft. In the days of JDAM and FLIR anybody can really put warheads on forheads now from a higher altitude at standoff range. The only fixed wing aircraft lost to enemy fire over Iraq the second time around was the A-10 mainly due to its flight profile its wing and engines dont carry the weight up at medium altitudes the way other fixed wing assets do. Now if it got the re-engine it was supposed to with the C model upgrade a lot of those problems would go away but in an effort to sell the kitchen sink to get the F-22 (No new AWACS, Half the Buffs gone, BRAC a lot of lower block F-16's, etc) the money just isnt there for it. When the A-10 came on line it was competing within the Air Force with the A-7 as the dominant attack only platform and I have met a number of combat vet AF pilots from the time that said they would take an A-7 over an A-10 because they liked the idea of relying on speed to get in and expose themselves less rather then be able to take a beating.
 

A4sForever

BTDT OLD GUY
pilot
Contributor
......Just to bring me out of the woodwork with your very unusual A-4 geometric positioning, overly dramatic and excessively descriptive "tracking.... tracking ... tracking .... GUNS KILL" F-4 kill 'fiction,' not to mention a later and unconscionable victory "barrel-roll" :icon_rage / :)...you wily old adversary :icon_wink :

But no-sir, A4s! I'm not taking any of your Heineman Hot Rod Bait! :) ....
Ahhhhhh .... I knew I could. I knew you would .... :D

ACTUALLY ... I was kinda thinking of YOU -- :D -- when I posted it. Ah, yes .... a near religious experience ....
:D
 

Single Seat

Average member
pilot
None
Something the AF guys never get, you win a war killing by the thousands on the ground, not one at a time in the air. If you get to shoot down a few Fulcrums on your way to the target, you're just having a really good day.
 

Catmando

Keep your knots up.
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
Ahhhhhh .... I knew I could. I knew you would .... :D

ACTUALLY ... I was kinda thinking of YOU -- :D -- when I posted it. Ah, yes .... a near religious experience ....
:D

Unfortunately, "predictability" was often a fatal flaw in aerial maneuvering.

Next time I should just bypass your inviting "bait" and do something a little more "unexpected" - something with a much higher P-sub-k. :D
 

Swanee

Cereal Killer
pilot
None
Contributor
Now if they could just work on that fratricide problem we would be in there. If I needed F/W support give me a Hornet or a Harrier every time.

A lot of that has to do with the fact that the AF and the Guard Bureau give a lot more money to Viper and Eagle units, (Especially in the Guard). The days have gone by when A-10 drivers spent 3 or 4 days a week flying to different Ranges to get used to coming into different situations. They just don't have the money to give full loads on ammo, and lots of dummy bombs to drop. In fact, the Guard A-10 units don't have a lot of money for AGR or Full-Time ARTs. Guys are flying the same pattern and approaches into the same ranges, feeling lucky if they get to talk to a JTAC on the ground. If the CAS guys got to train like the air to air guys get to train, I am willing to bet that the Frat rates would be a lot lower. I mean , come on, 6 sorties a month into the same range doesn't help you in the grand scheme of things, especially when you are going to be deployed. But alas, I'm ranting about the things I dislike with the Guard.
 

Lawman

Well-Known Member
None
A lot of that has to do with the fact that the AF and the Guard Bureau give a lot more money to Viper and Eagle units, (Especially in the Guard). The days have gone by when A-10 drivers spent 3 or 4 days a week flying to different Ranges to get used to coming into different situations. They just don't have the money to give full loads on ammo, and lots of dummy bombs to drop. In fact, the Guard A-10 units don't have a lot of money for AGR or Full-Time ARTs. Guys are flying the same pattern and approaches into the same ranges, feeling lucky if they get to talk to a JTAC on the ground. If the CAS guys got to train like the air to air guys get to train, I am willing to bet that the Frat rates would be a lot lower. I mean , come on, 6 sorties a month into the same range doesn't help you in the grand scheme of things, especially when you are going to be deployed. But alas, I'm ranting about the things I dislike with the Guard.


Id put a lot more on the fact that you have "fast movers" operating with Mk I Eyeball as their primary means of identifying and prosecuting a threat due to the lack of integrated avionics and flight sensors at the time of a lot of the incedents of fratracide. Hell Helo's had FLIR before anybody thought about putting anything on the A-10.
 

Catmando

Keep your knots up.
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
The function of a fighter aircraft is to achieve Air Superiority for our forces. And Air Superiority is absolutely essential to carry out any successful battle plan. Without Air Superiority, attack aircraft, and even cruise missiles will have some greater difficulty in reaching their target. Without Air Superiority, CAS is nearly impossible, troop movement is severely restricted, SAR is unlikely, reconnaissance is limited, and seaborne-craft become more vulnerable.

But in every conflict for the past half century, Air Superiority has been mostly handed to us on a silver platter, either by extremely limited number and capability of enemy fighter aircraft, or by the very nature of asymmetric warfare. Indeed, the US has not faced a credible air-to-air threat, either in capability or in numbers, for nearly the last 40 – 50 years!

But that certainly does not lessen the overriding importance, and the absolute necessity of Air Superiority. And it is important to note that our past and present, mostly uncontested Air Superiority, while key to all other facets of battle, might not always be the case in future conflicts.

Also, Air Superiority is not just an Air Force 'thing'. Witness the Marine's Joe Foss and Pappy Boyington, or the Navy's "Butch" O'Hare and David McCampbell. It was the success of the Marianna Turkey Shoot and Leyte Gulf decimating the Japanese Zero's that gave us the Air Superiority necessary to land on Iwo Jima and Okinawa and to end the war. Indeed, we even today respect and revere some of our enemy's fighter pilots who fought for Air Superiority – the Richthofen's and Galland' and Hartman's – men who in fact unfortunately killed many of our own men.

Time and technology have melded missions, and recent history may have seemed to obviate the fighter's mission. But the absolute necessity of Air Superiority – and the fighter pilots necessary to achieve that superiority in contested skies - always will remain. The often arrogant and obnoxious, prima dona fighter pilot may be easy to dislike and denigrate. . . . That is, until you need some serious fighter cover in seriously contested skies, filled with enemy fighters protecting their home airspace and intent upon killing you, to complete your important mission and return home safely.


[Disclaimer: As I have posted before here, when I say "fighter pilot," I often mean "fighter crew." I believe in the two-man foxhole as a superior form of fighting. And I know for a fact Cunningham would never been a fighter "Ace" without Driscoll. Furthermore, I have seen some of the best "fighter RIO's" talk a 'grape' pilot through a serious engagement, and win! (I owe my old RO's that disclaimer, since without one or two of them, I wouldn't be here to post this. :) )]
 

Single Seat

Average member
pilot
None
[Disclaimer: As I have posted before here, when I say "fighter pilot," I often mean "fighter crew." I believe in the two-man foxhole as a superior form of fighting. And I know for a fact Cunningham would never been a fighter "Ace" without Driscoll. Furthermore, I have seen some of the best "fighter RIO's" talk a 'grape' pilot through a serious engagement, and win! (I owe my old RO's that disclaimer, since without one or two of them, I wouldn't be here to post this. :) )]

I had a DI in OCS that said a Foxhole is where a fox hides scared, and unless you're a pussy the proper term is fighting hole.

And there are plenty of credible threats out there to give us reason to worry. Latest intel and analysis I read on the Su-27 made me sit back in my chair, refresh the SIPR net page, read it again, and go "shit".
 

SMILE4BULLETS

New Member
anyone know where this came from, "Don't ask a man if he's a fighter pilot! If he is...he'll let you know!"

recently, my mother told me that I skipped church as a young child to watch this movie. suddenly my life as a SNA made sense, haha.
 

Lawman

Well-Known Member
None
anyone know where this came from, "Don't ask a man if he's a fighter pilot! If he is...he'll let you know!"

recently, my mother told me that I skipped church as a young child to watch this movie. suddenly my life as a SNA made sense, haha.

The Great Santini, and also Flight of the Intruder. In Flight of the Intruder however it is said by a smartass who is quickly embarrased by an A-6 driver.
 

Catmando

Keep your knots up.
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
*sigh* .... If I had a dime for every time that happened ... I'd OWN this freakin' place right now .... *sigh* :)

Aw, c'mon. Ya mean the one – "wow, I didn't know an A-6 could do that" – turn....which was shortly followed by an A-6's, "aw s*#t - wadawedonow . . . OK, knock it off?"

With most opponents, it was usually advisable to attack out of the sun. But with the A-6, any aspect attack was good. But the best was from the BN's side! Didn't even engender that magic last turn. :D :D
 
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