-
Please take a moment and update your account profile. If you have an updated account profile with basic information on why you are on Air Warriors it will help other people respond to your posts. How do you update your profile you ask?
Go here:
Edit Account Details and Profile
USN Yardstick is the greatest pilot of all time...
- Thread starter Yardstick
- Start date
Agree with @Treetop Flyer . Fighter pilots are getting hired consistently with 1501 hours. It’s like clockwork. There’s even a question on the AA app that asks “are you now or have you ever been a fighter pilot?” So it doesn’t seem that the airliner-type military planes give much of an advantage these days at all. However @HAL Pilot ’s point stands that another 9/11 could change all that.
Facts. Airlines are clearly interested in fighter/attack pilots. Personally I think it would have been more challenging going through airline training with only single seat experience. But if you could fly a harrier/hornet/any other tactical jet...
An airliner is not that challenging.
Airlines are interested in pointy nose guys especially now because of the hiring climate and decreased number of qualified candidates. There are a lot less former military pilots available due to smaller military size than in former hiring booms. 5-6 years ago there were a fewer single seat guys as a percentage of new hires at the majors.
Yes if you can learn to fly a tactical jet, you can learn to fly an airliner. But also yes airline training is more challenging for single seat guys. In fact, I’d say that as a group, they have more issues and problems during airline training than other groups except for helo pilots. This is why when hiring times are lean, more multi engine big plane guys get hired at airlines than single seat pointy nose guys. Airlines like guys who fly the same type of planes better.
Airlines also like more hours over fewer hours. They realize single seat guys have less and maybe their hours were more challenging but in event of a tie, more always wins. Big plane military pilots tend to have more hours than single seat military pilots.
I’ve watched and lived airline hiring for 20 years. I’ve seen the cycles. Barring another 9/11 type event, a recession, etc. you are correct - pointy nose single seat guys will get hired at majors. However that can change with another downturn in airline business.
I’d also hazard to bet that after Helo pilots, there are more single seat guys having to spend a year or two at a regional than there are big plane military guys.
Bottom line - today you are right and for the foreseeable future you are right. But down the road who knows what the majors will need for pilot hiring. History tells us the big, multi piloted and multi engine guy has the advantage. It’s not criticizing single pilot guys, it’s just the way it is.
Yes if you can learn to fly a tactical jet, you can learn to fly an airliner. But also yes airline training is more challenging for single seat guys. In fact, I’d say that as a group, they have more issues and problems during airline training than other groups except for helo pilots. This is why when hiring times are lean, more multi engine big plane guys get hired at airlines than single seat pointy nose guys. Airlines like guys who fly the same type of planes better.
Airlines also like more hours over fewer hours. They realize single seat guys have less and maybe their hours were more challenging but in event of a tie, more always wins. Big plane military pilots tend to have more hours than single seat military pilots.
I’ve watched and lived airline hiring for 20 years. I’ve seen the cycles. Barring another 9/11 type event, a recession, etc. you are correct - pointy nose single seat guys will get hired at majors. However that can change with another downturn in airline business.
I’d also hazard to bet that after Helo pilots, there are more single seat guys having to spend a year or two at a regional than there are big plane military guys.
Bottom line - today you are right and for the foreseeable future you are right. But down the road who knows what the majors will need for pilot hiring. History tells us the big, multi piloted and multi engine guy has the advantage. It’s not criticizing single pilot guys, it’s just the way it is.
Last edited:
It’s nice to see a capital “H” up there.
Was that an accident or did you intend to do that?
Regardless, it looks good.
?
As a guy who spent 18 years flying single seat, single engine a/c, it was a challenge adapting to the multi-crew environment. I came into the Navy with commercial and instrument ratings under my belt and had to unlearn many habits I'd acquired and re-learn the Navy way. The transition from Navy flying to commercial aviation after my retirement was similar in that I had to re-learn how to do things with another guy sitting next to me and not just do it myself. Plus, I was older. And it's a well-known fact that old habits are extremely hard to break. The actual flying was never a problem. Doing it the airline way was something I always had to think about, even up to the day I retired from that career.
You can (in a way) and we went through this before in another thread (I know you know this, HAL). Unfortunately most FSDOs won't accept walk-ins anymore for this kind of stuff, so you have to pay an examiner to file the paperwork, but it's still easy to do once you figure out the abomination that is IACRA.
I still have yet to actually see proof of that. Most military sims aren't certified because it costs money. And it's up to PMA, not VP on whether something gets certified.
I’m flying the KC-135 now, which is basically
San Diego FSDO will still do it, for anyone in SoCal.
San Diego FSDO will still do it, for anyone in SoCal.
With the number of people there, I'm surprised, but that's great. They always have been pretty friendly there.
PMA does what the RO’s fund. RO’s fund what the community asks for (and can afford). Sim development is a convoluted animal even by NAVAIR bureaucracy standards...
I'm sure your longer historical perspective is accurate, but as a current data point, I don't really know any single seat pilot who got a DD-214 while being "current" who had to do a lap at the regionals, at least if they had 1501 hours and a wet ATP. I think that could be said about really anyone who has a FW background and competitive hours. However I say that and will probably end up being the first in years
Sure, but no one is going to ask to have the sim funded to be certified because it costs excess money. Not because there's some conspiracy to keep the (VP) JO down. Having spent a lot of time dealing with -205 (and sim development, among others), I'm seriously suspect that they even have the organizational wherewithal to keep track of said alleged conspiracy.
I'm with you there! PMA-205 couldn't deliver worse products if they tried. They might accidentally improve...
