I've read threads on here, and read through the official memo that was published a few years back. If someone wants to serve simultaneously as both a pilot and a physician, is there any reason to go Navy over Air Force? Whereas the AF's Pilot Physician Program is well-defined and actively recruiting on social media, it seems the Navy's equivalent is much smaller or perhaps non-existent. I'd love to hear from anyone in the know!
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What is the state of the dual designator program?
- Thread starter jf69
- Start date
FormerRecruitingGuru
Making Recruiting Great Again
Are you asking about being a Navy Flight Doc?
Just because something isn’t heavily advertised doesn’t mean it’s a “closed” program. Recruiting is often focused on hard to fill positions… why would recruiting spend money on something that gets plenty of applicants as is?
He is talking about the Aeromedical Dual Designator (AMDD) Program, which means you are essentially on Active Duty as a Naval Aviator while dual designated as a Flight Surgeon.
Program Authorization
I don't have much info on the current program, except to say that one of the guys I went through Primary with, who was in the flight surgeon syllabus at the time, recently went back through flight school and earned his wings and is now an AMDD, so the program is apparently still going. I believe we have an AMDD who posts on here so I'll let him talk through the specifics, but I think generally it is easier to enter the program as a qualified pilot who later earns their MD than the other way around, but that may changing.
Program Authorization
I don't have much info on the current program, except to say that one of the guys I went through Primary with, who was in the flight surgeon syllabus at the time, recently went back through flight school and earned his wings and is now an AMDD, so the program is apparently still going. I believe we have an AMDD who posts on here so I'll let him talk through the specifics, but I think generally it is easier to enter the program as a qualified pilot who later earns their MD than the other way around, but that may changing.
FormerRecruitingGuru
Making Recruiting Great Again
Fact of the day here.
Knockers talks about his path to becoming a dual-designator Naval Aerospace and Operational Physiologist (NAOP); he was a successful MH-60S pilot who then made the transition:
Safe on Deck: Episode 21 - Evan Knock (MH-60) on Apple Podcasts
Show Safe on Deck, Ep Episode 21 - Evan Knock (MH-60) - Jul 24, 2022
podcasts.apple.com
The first AMDD type to get their aviator wings in 20 years just got winged in the last month or so. The long hiatus seems to be a thing with that program, I went through the RAG with one AMDD types ~20 years ago and IIRC he was the first in ~10-15 years to do it.
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I guess Johnny Kim could also be considered dual designated? Or, is it triple designated?
What is your current status? Are you already a physician looking to be a pilot or are you applying to be a pilot with Navy/AF with goal of becoming a physician later?
You are absolutely correct, program is alive but most of AMDD currently are Pilot/NFO to Aeromedical Officer (Flight Surgeon, AMSO, Experimental Psychologist, etc). It is the primary path to become AMDD and is the much easier path if you are already designated as pilot/NFO first. The other way is rare, partially because of various limiting factors to include age limit, physical qualification (since you are much older compared to normal aviator accession population), and medical training requirement/timeline (i.e. residency training, flight surgeon qualification/obiligation, etc).
You have to meet all of the requirements, fit the timeline, and then have the patience for all of the paperwork/endorcement required to go medical --> pilot/NFO. On top of all that, you will have 8 years obligation from winging like all other naval aviator graduate with the obligation to serve in the fleet as pilot, which will throw off/delay your typical medical career. Probably not a common pathway most doctors/medical type are willing to accept.
Johnny is currently in training to be an AMDD but he already has a very unique path being a NASA Astronaut. I know of several current Flight Surgeons who are interested in becoming a pilot and is actively working on their AMDD application... will see what happens in few months and hope the program won't go back into the dormant phase.
Airforce PPP (Pilot-Physician Program) are by far more active getting Medical to Pilot candidates as of right now, but hope Navy will catch up one day.
Thank you Dan, @Flash and @KODAK for the insights, this forum is an indescribably huge help as I plan out my career.
The BLUF is that I’m 24 and at the end of a pretty enjoyable intel contract with my degree completed. After logging flight hours and volunteering in clinics, I know I want a path that can have me doing both. All signs point to prioritizing flying first since the medicine route puts me graduating and finishing intern year at 30-31… too close to cut offs and a lot of years to get injured.
I’m applying to pilot roles with both Navy and AF now. Thanks again for all the good insights