VT Primary and NIFE Manuevers

[ChuckMK23]

1. Are Short / Soft Field takeoffs and landings a manuever in NIFE? Can anyone speak to the incidence of tail strikes on these manuevers?

2. What about in Primary - Contact? Is short field ops a thing / designated manuever? Climbout at Vx? Are tail strikes in the T-6 a thing and is it a discussion in STAN community?

Thanks!!!

 

[villo0692]

1. Are Short / Soft Field takeoffs and landings a manuever in NIFE? Can anyone speak to the incidence of tail strikes on these manuevers?
Thanks!!!

During my NIFE checkride, thanks to a cold front we had to use the short runway to take off. During a touch and go my instructor made the executive decision to climb out using VX, since I had a bit of a long landing. Other than that it was never mentioned more than the occasional limits question. Idk about primary, just started with sims here

 

[MIDNJAC]

Is Vx climb out a particular risk factor? It has been a long time since I did one, but I don't recall reefing the nose up wildly being part of the mechanics. Gotta get airborne before you do any of these fancy pilot tricks. There is a lot of margin for error once you get up into ground effect (IIRC proper short/soft field takeoff technique), with respect to slapping the tail on the ground.

 

[Gatordev]

I know you're asking about the T-6, and I can't answer that, but I have a feeling it may have a similar issue. In the T-34, climbout was at 100 knots and not some other V speed due to visibility. With the long PT-6 in the front, keeping the nose down aided in traffic avoidance in a busy terminal area like NSE. This was also augmented by doing 30 degree turns on climbout (specific to the NSE course rules).

Landings were always done at one of three speeds: flaps down (90), flaps up (100), and AOA (20 units, which was ~100 knots). There was zero concern with tail strike because those speeds would give the proper approach angle. I believe the T-6 has the same characteristics, albeit with different approach speeds.

Your question about Vx speeds does make me want to dive into the subject a bit more on the helo side, as it's a question I'm curious to discuss with the TPS nerds here, but I'll save it for later.

 

[Cowgirl]

As far as NIFE Flight Phase, you will always climb out at Vy unless there is a NOTAM about an obstruction that will affect normal TO distances, or if instructed by the PIC. If so, then climb out at Vx. As far as landings, they have adapted the racetrack pattern you learn in Primary to fit the Cessna 172-P. It is a flaps 20/30 option but they would prefer you to slip to land if approach is high.

I have not heard of anyone having a tail strike although I only spent a few weeks there. Best of luck!

 

[FLGUY]

1. Are Short / Soft Field takeoffs and landings a manuever in NIFE? Can anyone speak to the incidence of tail strikes on these manuevers?

2. What about in Primary - Contact? Is short field ops a thing / designated manuever? Climbout at Vx? Are tail strikes in the T-6 a thing and is it a discussion in STAN community?

Thanks!!!

There isn’t a dedicated short field takeoff procedure in primary. Every takeoff in contacts follows the same basic procedure, only deviating slightly to account for gust factor with regards to rotation speed, and stick position to account for wind direction.

Tail strikes aren’t super common, usually experienced whenever a student floats a landing far too long, or deviates above the recommended pitch attitudes for takeoff.

Since the T-6 has such good climb performance, even on shorter runways we never really have to concern ourselves with ft/nm climb gradients or having to gnats-ass perf numbers for a ODP, we don’t typically worry about VX climbs on takeoff.

Approach to stall recoveries however, are the closest thing we have to a true “VX” climb.

 

[miss1ng]

I don’t think any pipeline sees short-field ops until the RAG, and i’m assuming it’s platform or tactic specific (i.e. C130s and such). NIFE absolutely doesn’t, Primary no, and the closest thing in Multiengine Advanced is ripping the props into reverse just to get the nearest taxi off the runway lol.

 

[MIDNJAC]

I don’t think any pipeline sees short-field ops until the RAG, and i’m assuming it’s platform or tactic specific (i.e. C130s and such). NIFE absolutely doesn’t, Primary no, and the closest thing in Multiengine Advanced is ripping the props into reverse just to get the nearest taxi off the runway lol.

Reminds me of a dude I flew with recently, who would manually rip out the (auto)spoilers the second the mains touched, and would throw the APU switch on at about 130 knots on rollout. He apparently spent a lot of years flying C-9s in SELRES, after a little bit of time in the P-3. He also refused to do anything work related until the boarding door was closed and the parking brake had been released and then reset (that's what triggers the paycheck)

Fun guy to spend a trip with though, in spite of the "eccentricities"

 

[Gatordev]

FWIW, they do practice short field ops in the HTs.

 

[FLGUY]

FWIW, they do practice short field ops in the HTs.

Isn’t that just a normal helicopter landing?

 

[HSMPBR]

FWIW, they do practice short field ops in the HTs.

Isn’t that just a normal helicopter landing?