Turning down Pilot slot for Other Service

[JTS11]

I can't recall any Marines who washed out of the aviation pipeline getting redesignated infantry, or any other combat arms MOS, for that matter.

 

[Swanee]

I can't recall any Marines who washed out of the aviation pipeline getting redesignated infantry, or any other combat arms MOS, for that matter.

Same.

I saw some guys go infantry and then come to flight school (both because of the long wait time and the need for infantry platoon commanders in the reserve battalions or on a fleet accession board) but everyone I saw who failed out of flight school ended up supply or logistics or finance or adj or AMO or really anything but a combat arms MOS.

 

[Slingblade]

Possible but it's kind of hard to show up to an infantry battalion as a first lieutenant because you have been spending all of your time as a 2nd lieutenant washing out of flight school. Infantry officers grow up quick and by the time they are first lieutenants the ones that are good are already picked to go on to bigger better things find themselves as company XOs or weapons platoon commanders before they put on captain .....do a b billet go to resident PME and come back as company commanders as mid to senior O3s. So what I'm saying is the career progression timeline as an aviator is different than it is for an infantry officer especially early in your career and that if you want to be an infantry officer go do that and if you want to be a Marine aviator go do that. Infantry officer is not a next best thing if this flying thing doesn't work out. It's two very challenging career tracks either way. If anything I believe being an infantry officer requires a great deal of maturity early on where you are instantly in charge of and responsible for Marines as a platoon commander. That doesn't happen right away in aviation.

I've seen a few flight school attrites go 0302 (Infantry Officer). One I know of for sure didn't do well as an Infantry Officer either as he was already well behind the power curve in that MOS. See my above quote from a previous thread for why this might be. Think he never got career designated and he was done once his 4 years were up. One "combat" deployment where he didn't really get to see "combat" because he was a known liability.

• As far as going USMC after already having a Navy OCS ship date.......I'd probably talk to the USMC Officer Recruiter. At the end of the day though it is your life so I would make sure you are all in on what you are trying to do.
• I started my process with a Navy recruiter MEPS, ASTB with pretty much all intent on going to the Marines. We just didn't have a Marine Officer Recruiter in Las Vegas. Closest Marine OSO was Phoenix, AZ and Salt Lake City, Utah. That is different though as I didn't get all the way through the selection process so I am not completely sure how the USMC boards would look at it. Best bet is find a USMC OSO and get their take on it.

 

[exNavyOffRec]

I applied to the USN for a pilot slot and I have just been notified that I have been selected and have been given an OCS date. However I am considering turning it down to go through the entire pilot application process again with the USMC. These are my reasons:

1) The USMC aviation platforms are more widely focused towards combat roles (Rotary, Jet, Tilt). I feel that there is more of a chance at getting the chance to see combat with the wider scope of platforms in the USMC then the USN, which I would only be interested in Jets. I feel that this is a fair justification.

2) I have been recently been more exposed to the roles that the USMC has in the aviation community. My goal in joining the military is to be an officer and see combat. I don't think that the USN gets a chance to see as much combat as the USMC does.

3) Aviation Flight school is difficult for both communities. When looking at this decision I am considering the situation of me "failing" flight school. Shitty mentality, however I want to take it into account. If I fail out of flight school in the Navy I would be stuck lateraling to SWO. In the USMC, I would get the chance to go into infantry which is more desirable in my case.

4) I am in the 290+ PFT with USMC, and I would have a strong chance of getting an OCS slot.

5) I would rather be an officer in the USMC than the USN. I think that this is reason enough for the thought of this decision.



These are the questions for the group:::
1) How often does the Navy see combat in the aviation community (dropping warheads on foreheads). From people that I have talked to the USN is has fleet defensive missions. The USMC supports infantry and therefore gets the chance to be in combat more. I can't remember the last time I heard of Navy Jets fighting in the war against terror. Thoughts?

2) What is the chances of getting into infantry if I fail out of Aviation School? I understand that they are a breed of their own.

2) How stupid is this? Truly my first thought is that this is retarded and un-wise. However it is a 10 year commitment - I want to be in a service that fits.

3) Would the USMC pickup that I "quit" out of the USN flight selection program.

1) all my tours have been on CVN's and all we did on my deployments was support the troops on the ground, so as long as a CVN is in the middle east there will most likely be combat operations.

3) yes as on the application each service will ask "have you ever applied for a commission before", so then you would have to disclose you did and then you declined.

What if you did get picked up USMC pass flight school and then you are selected for C-130's? Have you looked at the actual combat aircraft breakdown of the USMC and USN?

What if you fail from USMC flight school and like Swanee mentioned get finance or logistics sitting behind a desk?

RG said your profile said your age was 32 is that correct? if so you have like one shot with the USN and pretty sure you are over limit for USMC

 

[Ventus]

I can't recall any Marines who washed out of the aviation pipeline getting redesignated infantry, or any other combat arms MOS, for that matter.

A good friend of mine washed after he had passed helicopter school and went back to Corpus Christi. He was designated to fly drones for the Marines, but then at the last second, the Marine Corps was like "hey you're good looking and look kind of ethnic, we want you to be a Public Affairs Officer." So now he's doing that.

As far as KC-130's, I know at least 2 of the VMGR units have done trial runs of that Harvest Hawk program where they basically replace wing pods with Hellfire Missile racks as well as a special launcher that shoots backwards out of the rear hatch and acquires the target. Talked to an XO about it and it sounded really cool. I don't know whether they would have an NFO do that or train the pilots to use the system. Probably the latter.

 

[mad dog]

..."hey you're good looking and look kind of ethnic, we want you to be a Public Affairs Officer."

...and if you’re really, really good looking [Zoolander good looking], they want you to be a Public Affairs Officer...and fly...

 

[whitesoxnation]

I flew all 8 years I was in the fleet. I tried to do the the other Marine shit but had to stay flying due to MOS manning. I can say that’s also true for many of my peers in VMM land

That is closer to reality. The manning situation is not good. Plenty of MARADMINs out there trying to keep people in or bring them back to the cockpit. There is good and bad that comes with that.

 

[Pags]

 

[Jim123]

Did you just say the word?

 

[Griz882]

Between your desire for combat action and your stated goal of not doing "stupid shit" unrelated to aviation, it strikes me that you want to be an Army WO pilot.

 

[insanebikerboy]

What's the stronger desire, to fly or to be a Marine? You've already got a pilot slot and you want to give it up to maybe get a USMC pilot slot? I won't tell you not to do that, but realize what you already have is far and away more than a lot of other people who tried to get a slot.

Also...combat...getting shot at really ain't as fun or as cool as it sounds.

 

[taxi1]

Between your desire for combat action and your stated goal of not doing "stupid shit" unrelated to aviation, it strikes me that you want to be an Army WO pilot.

I was kind of thinking that too.

Back in the day (WAY back in the day) I knew some attrites that went SpecWar. If you're a PT animal who proves to not be so aeronautically adaptable for any number of reasons, could be a possibility?

 

[Treetop Flyer]

OP, nothing wrong with wanting to pick a platform likely to go to combat.

A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. In this case, turning down the Navy might actually hurt your chances, but ask an OSO.

Nothing wrong with wanting to be a Marine. Keep in mind that if you don’t make it through flight school, you probably won’t wind up in a desirable MOS. That goes for Navy as well. Of course you have to get to and get through OCS first.

 

[Griz882]

Of course you have to get to and get through OCS first.

And, if you go Marines, TBS (The Bummer Summer)!

 

[Hotdogs]

I applied to the USN for a pilot slot and I have just been notified that I have been selected and have been given an OCS date. However I am considering turning it down to go through the entire pilot application process again with the USMC. These are my reasons:

1) The USMC aviation platforms are more widely focused towards combat roles (Rotary, Jet, Tilt). I feel that there is more of a chance at getting the chance to see combat with the wider scope of platforms in the USMC then the USN, which I would only be interested in Jets. I feel that this is a fair justification.

2) I have been recently been more exposed to the roles that the USMC has in the aviation community. My goal in joining the military is to be an officer and see combat. I don't think that the USN gets a chance to see as much combat as the USMC does.

3) Aviation Flight school is difficult for both communities. When looking at this decision I am considering the situation of me "failing" flight school. Shitty mentality, however I want to take it into account. If I fail out of flight school in the Navy I would be stuck lateraling to SWO. In the USMC, I would get the chance to go into infantry which is more desirable in my case.

4) I am in the 290+ PFT with USMC, and I would have a strong chance of getting an OCS slot.

5) I would rather be an officer in the USMC than the USN. I think that this is reason enough for the thought of this decision.



These are the questions for the group:::
1) How often does the Navy see combat in the aviation community (dropping warheads on foreheads). From people that I have talked to the USN is has fleet defensive missions. The USMC supports infantry and therefore gets the chance to be in combat more. I can't remember the last time I heard of Navy Jets fighting in the war against terror. Thoughts?

2) What is the chances of getting into infantry if I fail out of Aviation School? I understand that they are a breed of their own.

2) How stupid is this? Truly my first thought is that this is retarded and un-wise. However it is a 10 year commitment - I want to be in a service that fits.

3) Would the USMC pickup that I "quit" out of the USN flight selection program.

Couple quick answers to your questions in no particular order:

1) Yes, Marine aircraft are more combat oriented, but the chances you see combat in the majority of Marine aircraft these days are low. Unless you are in a VMFA/VMA. There have been some one off occasions in random shit holes that non-VMFA/VMA Marines have done some work, but Navy pilots have about the same (or greater in some cases) amount of chance of seeing “combat” as Marines do. If your idea of “combat” is dropping bombs from >15k.

2) These days you’re most likely not going to go Infantry out of failing flight school. Unless you goto IOC in between TBS and API, and have the MOS already. Pretty rare to do that and is based on wait times in the aviation pipelines and seat availability at IOC. These days I do not think that is going to happen.

3) Not sure why you want to goto “combat” as a goal. I understand the patriotic rationale for it, but I would focus on the 100m target right now. You say some shit like that in any gun squadron, You’ll get mocked horrendously.

4) The Corps handles It’s pilots very differently. You will be doing stupid shit in both services not related to flying. That’s a reasons (amongst others) that a lot of them a running for the door as soon as their contract is up right now. There are more opportunities in the Navy to do other things just due to its size. The Corps handcuffs the shit out of Marine pilots with mandatory education boards, MEF IAs, FAC tours, and various other timing/career implications that are above your head right now.

5) Nobody gives a shit about your PFT score. I’ve seen dude get selected with a 240 and do fine at Brown Field.

6) If you’ve been keeping up on current military events and news, The Corps is going to be doing a lot more supporting the Navy than supporting grunts in the near future. The Corps is an infantry centric organization, but there are a lot of times where Marine Air and other parts of the Corps will support the fleet. That is probably only going to increase.

Have you had this conversation with a USMC recruiter? Curious as to their thoughts...

Hah... Most OSOs due to manning are not pilots. Generally have no idea when it comes to pilot career paths, training, and deployments. Probably only useful for navigating the aviation accession processes.

What if you did get picked up USMC pass flight school and then you are selected for C-130's? Have you looked at the actual combat aircraft breakdown of the USMC and USN?

Jackpot!