see link. it may or may not be bull shit. i dunno.
http://www.uskowioniran.com/2009/09/iranian-f-14-tomcat-achievements.html
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"To you all, from us all, for having the guts to try"
- Thread starter Renegade One
- Start date
see link. it may or may not be bull shit. i dunno.
http://www.uskowioniran.com/2009/09/iranian-f-14-tomcat-achievements.html
I have an Iranian friend (good guy who fought the Iraqis as a grunt when young, but loves our country and now flies for one of our major US airlines) who still has a few friends and family back in Iran. He travels back there occasionally to visit.
Upon his return from visiting and as a gift to me several years ago, he sent me a series of collectable Iranian postcards, two of which are pictured below. Apparently they were/are pretty proud of our… later their F-14s. – As was my friend when they scored heavily against Iraq in the Iran/Iraq war when he fought there.
For me, I just hope they have by now rusted away into a pile of ash.
Upon his return from visiting and as a gift to me several years ago, he sent me a series of collectable Iranian postcards, two of which are pictured below. Apparently they were/are pretty proud of our… later their F-14s. – As was my friend when they scored heavily against Iraq in the Iran/Iraq war when he fought there.
For me, I just hope they have by now rusted away into a pile of ash.
Tom Cooper, perhaps the best open source, albeit controversial expert on this subject (with whom I have traded a number of emails over the years) believes they are still flying... FWIW.
LINKY
He is the 'best' source because he is the only one. I remember seeing something a little while ago that Tom Cooper isn't even his real name but a nom de plume, how can you trust a guy to be a serious historian when he doesn't even use his real name?
Perhaps he does not use his "real name" because of Iranian threats against his life?
Apparently Iran is not too keen on some guy busting their OPSEC and writing publically about their supposedly secret military capabilities.
Various Iranian Assassination Attempts
The Iranians are just like anyone else, they like to trumpet their military successes real and imagined when they get the chance. Not only that this guy would be a really small fish when compared to the other folks on any Iranian hit list so I think any 'threat' against him would be minimal. If he did what he said and interviewed the aircrew himself the Iranians would have know what he was doing anyways. And how do we know what qualifications this guy has anyways to write about the subject? For all we know he is plumber who writes books in his Mom's basement in his spare time. Looking online you can't find his real name or even nationality.
The biggest beef I have with him is that he claims, without any proof at all, that he interviewed the Iranian aircrew then takes their claims at face value. How is any serious historian supposed to take him seriously when he plays 'I got a secret' with his info? The claims he takes at face value includes an F-14 getting four 'kills' from a single Phoenix and F-14s alone shooting down 25% of the Iraqi Air Force in the first three months of the war. Possible? Maybe, but it really stretches the bounds of credulity especially when compared to what we know factually about Iranian successes compared to their claims which very rarely match up. Reading the book some of the kill claims were based on firing a missile then seeing the target disappear from radar, and that happens in more than instance. Sorry but if that counts as a 'confirmed kill' then their bar for confirmation is pretty damn low. He also echoes Iranian complaints about how they got no support from the US for their planes, complaints you still hear today about their commercial aircraft. Not providing any context about why we cut them off in the first place, just 'woe the poor Iranians' crap.
I think there is a willingness to take the claims at face value mainly because there is so little factual info on the war. I also think there is a keen desire by some to see the supposed success of the F-14 and their American-trained crews. There is almost a sort of mythical status accorded the F-14 among some that it's contemporaries don't have and the fantastic Iranian F-14 kill claims would somehow validate that status in the eyes of some, especially when in US service it only got 5 kills. I think it is just a bit too much wishful thinking.
I don’t know if Tom Cooper is his real name or not. Nor do I care. Many respected people use nom de plumes. Ever hear of Samuel Clemens?
My Iranian friend who escaped the revolution to the U.S with his family does not use his real name here publicly. Only close friends know his real name. I highly doubt he is an assassination target. But when you grow up under the SAVAK, and now travel to Iran and back with their Revolutionary guard, you try to avoid “problems.”
As I initially stated, Mr. Cooper is controversial. And I certainly am not an apologist for him. Nevertheless he is far from a “plumber who writes books in his Mom's basement.” In fact he has for years been quoted in most all of the respected aviation periodicals. His research does carry a lot of weight with many knowledgable people. And while you couldn’t fine “his real name” online, his Austrian nationality is quite easy to discover.
I will agree that some of his reporting stretches the truth. But he relays only what he is told. And fighter pilots of all shades have been known to exaggerate.
Both he and Farzad Bishop are about the only experts on Iranian aircraft. And despite some glaring exceptions, they seem to be fairly accurate in many if not most cases.
I remember Heyjoe posting of talking to Mr. Cooper and being impressed, here.
Mark Twain didn't pretend to be a historian, wasn't afraid to be photographed and certainly didn't hide who he was. Plus he was a good writer.
Just because he might be 'published' or that he is the only one who bothers to write about a subject doesn't mean he is an expert. I just read an article from an 'expert' on stealth in a 'respected aviation periodical' and it was trash, the guy may have some book knowledges on the subject but the article was riddled with inaccuracies. Just relaying info doesn't make him a serious historian or even author, it makes him a stenographer. The fact that some of his reporting stretches the truth and that he is 'fairly accurate' makes all of his info suspect. I just got done with some internet browsing looking at some of his other work and while he has some decent insight he is way off the mark with a lot of his info. Like claiming a Falcon 50 was responsible for shooting the Exocets that hit the USS Stark or every time a US ship passes through the SOH local phones ring because of the ECM/ECCM from the ships. Eh?
Once he starts writing stuff that would get a passing grade in a college history course, including citations and source documentation, maybe I'll start to buy what he writes.