The USAF needs pilots? And the navy does too?

[wink]

If not Growlers then they put all the VAQ eggs in the F-35 basket. They are selling that radar as an offensive electronic attack weapon, but there is nothing officially on the tables, so far, in terms of a notional F-35B electronic attack mission/doctrine. We haven't even seen it in the F-22, which is the only other aircraft with that capability. It is all on paper. All I see is articles, marketing, and engineers postulating.

 

[Brett327]

The EA variant of the F-35 is an unfunded pipe dream, more so now than ever, given our fiscal woes. I'm curious what the HQMC party line is on it.

 

[HooverPilot]

There are a few things published about the USMC and their desires for the F-35 in regards to EW. Bottom line, the USMC is not looking for an EW Variant of the F-35. They intend to build an EW POD to augment the existing systems.

USMC Party Line last August
Lockheed's thoughts on the EW/EA variant last November
Navy's thoughts last December
General Amos in April "refined" the USMC party line. Scroll down to the Jamming, Cyber, and the Great Convergence section
The AF has stood up the 513th EWS to support the EW systems of the F-35. More than just traditional reprogramming?
Lockheed also advertises the EW capabilities of all models of the F-35

 

[Brett327]

Lots of misconceptions floating around, but the Freedberg article essentially addresses many of them. Easy to drift into technical details here, so let's not go down that road. That said:

EW =/= EA
EA in the A/A environment =/= SEAD

There are lots of apples vs. oranges comparisons being tossed carelessly about the discussion, which isn't very helpful to those trying to understand the issues. BL: Unless (until) USMC funds and develops an external pod capable of doing real SEAD type EA, the F-35 isn't going to fill the capabilities gap left when Marine Prowlers go away. Amos seems to imply (aspirationally) that they're going to strap an ALQ-99 or NGJ pod to the F-35. None of that is being seriously looked at by NAVAIR. With the amount of money that NAVAIR is putting into the Next Gen Jammer for the Growlers, it's difficult for me to imagine a completely separate endeavor just so that the Marines can have an organic EA based SEAD capability.

 

[Hotdogs]

There are lots of apples vs. oranges comparisons being tossed carelessly about the discussion, which isn't very helpful to those trying to understand the issues. BL: Unless (until) USMC funds and develops an external pod capable of doing real SEAD type EA, the F-35 isn't going to fill the capabilities gap left when Marine Prowlers go away. Amos seems to imply (aspirationally) that they're going to strap an ALQ-99 or NGJ pod to the F-35. None of that is being seriously looked at by NAVAIR. With the amount of money that NAVAIR is putting into the Next Gen Jammer for the Growlers, it's difficult for me to imagine a completely separate endeavor just so that the Marines can have an organic EA based SEAD capability.

I've heard other things being mentioned too. Like a UAS platform as mentioned above.

I think it would be a mistake to get out of the EW game, especially from my platform's perspective.

 

[Recovering LSO]

This....

I've heard other things being mentioned too. Like a UAS platform as mentioned above.

 

[Flash]

......it's difficult for me to imagine a completely separate endeavor just so that the Marines can have an organic EA based SEAD capability.

This. The Marines have been able to ride off of DoD's investment in the Prowler after it was selected by default as the primary EA platform for close to two decades now, primarily because they already had the planes when the decision was made in the 90's which EA aircraft to keep. The USMC's long dedication to EA, from the EF-10 and EA-6A to today, is quite admirable and even surprising in a way when compared to the USAF's relative neglect of the discipline over the years. But in today's current fiscal environment the Marines simply can't afford the expensive and specialized manned aircraft needed for the mission, especially when their only practical option is and aircraft that is a political hot potato for them in the big picture.

I can see them possibly utilizing a version to the NGJ on the JSF as a secondary mission for the VMFA squadrons like ATARS, possibly co-opting (or jsut plain stealing ) USAF efforts in that area if they were smart, or utilizing UAV's though the Marines have been pretty cheap on investing on those as a service.

 

[HooverPilot]

The Marines have been dabbling in developing their own equipment/software, to fit their needs as of late. The IT2 and EWBM are just a few examples of this. IN MCO 3430.2C, The Marines clearly state that they will develop what they need to support the MAGTF in the EMS. I don't know if we ever will see a pod developed for the F-35, but I don't doubt that the Marines will try.

 

[Treetop Flyer]

Everyone loves the IT2

 

[Navy Ship]

Over at BaseOps / Flying Squadron, there are multiple threads of why there is a shortage of pilots, particularly fighters. I'm not quite sure I understand the reason though. Something about the air force continuing cuts for too long. I though it would be easy for them to fill these slots though, considering the number of OTS applicants. Where does the trouble stem from?

Plus I heard they were cutting pilots due to sequestration. The Air National Guard guys down the road use to fly those F-16s way more frequently. Now we barely see them go up.

Maybe the Air Force can sponsor Top Gun 2, where Maverick flies DC-8 spaceships (without engines) to fight the evil invaders of Lord Xenu. Then at the end they can write "It's not science fiction, its what we do every day"

 

[e6bflyer]

The Air Force needs pilots to fill ACC (fighter guys) staff billets. Their line pilots are stretched too thin and the Staff billets normally reserved for them are going to AMC guys. This plus there is still a draw to fill UAS slots that are also in high demand. It doesn't need new guys, it needs old guys to stick around and AFPC sees the writing on the wall with airline hiring and their ever decreasing QOL equaling pilots leaving in droves. They are (smartly) throwing money at the problem before it becomes an emergency. If they are really smart, they will start working on QOL first and repealing some of the stupid PME and hardship tour requirements they have mandated in the last decade.
This is coming from a guy who is not in the AF, but works with them regularly. It is what I have been told.

 

[ea6bflyr]

Plus I heard they were cutting pilots due to sequestration. The Air National Guard guys down the road use to fly those F-16s way more frequently. Now we barely see them go up.

Maybe the Air Force can sponsor Top Gun 2, where Maverick flies DC-8 spaceships (without engines) to fight the evil invaders of Lord Xenu. Then at the end they can write "It's not science fiction, its what we do every day"

Maybe they can call it Top Sim....