The Right Stuff

[picklesuit]

It's nice to see there are some real innovators out there. I think Sir Branson proves that if you throw enough effort, ingenuity, and a few dollars at a problem you can overcome almost any obstacle. I can't wait to make my first Million so I can get a seat (or I'll just wait 40 years until we all have jetpacks)

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,392501,00.html

 

[scoolbubba]

even at 200k a pop, are the seats on this thing ever going to make it profitable?

or, is the hope that once it becomes reliable enough to repeatedly send into space, Sir Richard can knock NASA out of its monopoly on satellite launches to get into the megabucks? space tourism doesn't seem like something that is really ever going to turn a profit.

 

[Blutonski816]

even at 200k a pop, are the seats on this thing ever going to make it profitable?

or, is the hope that once it becomes reliable enough to repeatedly send into space, Sir Richard can knock NASA out of its monopoly on satellite launches to get into the megabucks? space tourism doesn't seem like something that is really ever going to turn a profit.

IIRC the curret price for lifting cargo to orbit on an unmanned Launched vehicle is $10K per lb. I could be wrong, it could be less now...

This thing is suborbital, so when you factor in the method of launch, I'm sure they'll be making some kind of profit...

but I agree, unless there is significant government spending similar to what was done for commercial passenger aviation, space tourism on a large scale is a pipe dream for everyone except the absurdly rich.

 

[BACONATOR]

Pfft. Forget a 200K pricetag for a ballistic vehicle. I'll just strap myself on to a missile. When the thing can put me into orbit (hint: impossible for a single-stage vehicle), THEN we'll talk.

 

[Dirty]

COD's anyone?

 

[AllAmerican75]

Pfft. Forget a 200K pricetag for a ballistic vehicle. I'll just strap myself on to a missile. When the thing can put me into orbit (hint: impossible for a single-stage vehicle), THEN we'll talk.

Technically, if the launch method is similar to what they won the X-Prize with, it isn't single stage.

 

[BACONATOR]

Technically, if the launch method is similar to what they won the X-Prize with, it isn't single stage.

Fine, but the Delta_V/altitude provided by dropping it out of a plane at a couple hundred knots and 50000ft ain't going to get you much closer to 7km/s or whatever delta_V is required for orbital insertion.

 

[johnny utah]

not gonna lie, I really like watching the private space industry grow. Especially since NASA doesn't like my BS in Flight Ops.

 

[AllAmerican75]

Fine, but the Delta_V/altitude provided by dropping it out of a plane at a couple hundred knots and 50000ft ain't going to get you much closer to 7km/s or whatever delta_V is required for orbital insertion.

True. I wish there was some add-on to Firefox that allowed for proper mathematical notation. Having to write "delta_V" just looks terrible.

 

[eddie]

Pfft. Forget a 200K pricetag for a ballistic vehicle. I'll just strap myself on to a missile. When the thing can put me into orbit (hint: impossible for a single-stage vehicle), THEN we'll talk.

Why is it impossible?

 

[BACONATOR]

Why is it impossible?

Goddamn it. I knew someone would ask. Please don't make me find my text books...

Suffice it to say that it is virtually impossible because the more fuel you add, the more weight you add, and there is a limit of delta_V for each stage on a rocket, and that limit for single-stage rockets is below the required delta_V for orbital flight. IIRC 2-stage is possible, 3 stage is ideal and then it begins to taper off after that. If I had my textbook in front of me or if another AE can chime in, be my guest.

This is just the reader's digest version.

 

[PropAddict]

I don't want to dig out my textbook either, but IIRC, single stage wasn't impossible, it was just soooo much easier to get to escape velocity (roughly 11 km/s) using staging.

It actually, from the Staging Equation, makes it look easier the more stages you add. The issue is that the equation I recall using doesn't account for all the extra ducting and tubing and valves required to add more stages. That weight gangs up on you, and poses a practical limit on the # of stages.

Okay FINE I'll find the damn book. Gotta be here somewhere. . .

 

[eddie]

I'm too stoopid to figure out on my own why breaking it up in stages helps any though.

I'll wiki it or something.

I did. I think I get it. I won't try to explain it though.

 

[Beans]

Rocket Propulsion Elements is a good one.

Also, you can find a walk-through of the equations here. They get pretty nasty at the end... as they say, it is rocket science.

 

[PropAddict]

Yeah, it is rocket science, which means it's always easier to kidnap some foreigners and get them to do the work for you.

I always go to Understanding Space by Kirkpatrick. It has lots of cartoons and cutesy drawings, and a lot of the text is written as though directed at a third grade audience (it WAS written by an Air Force cat). The hard science and math is rigorous, though.

BTW-checked and a single stager can go into orbit, it just taxes the limit of our current chemical rocket engine efficiencies. It also permits so little usable payload to hit orbit, that it just doesn't make a lot of sense, what with multistage jobs so easy to come by. (Pgs. 591 and following, for those of you playing along at home)