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Studying for C4390
- Thread starter ccsv
- Start date
Concur... there are/were posters in the 28 student ready room about "NO INFLIGHT GOUGE" - which is taken to mean anything that isn't in the "inflight guide."jamnww said:
I've also had a "buddy" down a checkride in the HTs for having a course rules gouge sheet on his kneeboard (among other things).
Just to clear up my last post-
I never said anything about putting flight maneuver procedures or gouge on your kneeboard... Last time I checked, your blue brain (inflight guide) was issued to you along with your natops, pcl and course rules books- and wasnt considered gouge. I don't see anything wrong with having useful pages on the kneeboard handy incase you need them to back yourself up. Actually, I was under the impression that you had to have the blue brains with you when you flew anyways.
I was always told to fly your checkride like you would a solo. Being unsafe is the quickest way to down the ride, not to mention maybe get yourself killed.
Here in corpus, the wind sometimes switches and causes you to takeoff or land on a rarely used runway- Its happened to a lot of people on checkrides... I know of at least one that almost taxied on the active because he got confused and didnt know how he was supposed to go because he had never used that runway- one of the reasons the IP ended up unsatting him (the other was because he didn't verbalize to the IP that he saw a T-44 still on the runway when he was going to land and intended to use cnatra reduced mins- which is a dumb idea on a checkride or solo- or waveoff, and the IP thought he was going land). Another departed waldron incorrectly- another big nono. Those things along with busting the working should be easy to avoid with descent SA (but, I guess I was wrong for loading the working areas in the GPS as a backup as well)
On my SFS flights, the IPs asked me the entry procedures to the OLFs prior to starting the entry, I knew the procedures- but it was nice knowing that I could glance down at the little picture with the dotted lines all drawn out in case they asked me something non standard. during the ODO solo briefs I'd get asked if I knew the different VHF freqs in case my UHF **** the bed- I told them I didn't have them memorized, but showed them how I had my kneeboard setup. I never had any IP challenge my use of my kneeboard like that. A couple of them actually thought it was a good idea.
ccsv, you asked about ways to avoid course rules violations that would get you a down. Thats how I did it- I didn't realize trying to put all the tools they give you to good use to stay safe was that bad of an idea, (it seems to be percieved that way by some here). I never had any issues with it though. If you like my ideas but are unsure how they will be percieved, then ask your onwing, and talk to your checkride IP about it during the brief. If they don't want you to have any of that stuff to back yourself up and stay safe, just put it back in the blue brain, and put that in your map case.
I never said anything about putting flight maneuver procedures or gouge on your kneeboard... Last time I checked, your blue brain (inflight guide) was issued to you along with your natops, pcl and course rules books- and wasnt considered gouge. I don't see anything wrong with having useful pages on the kneeboard handy incase you need them to back yourself up. Actually, I was under the impression that you had to have the blue brains with you when you flew anyways.
I was always told to fly your checkride like you would a solo. Being unsafe is the quickest way to down the ride, not to mention maybe get yourself killed.
Here in corpus, the wind sometimes switches and causes you to takeoff or land on a rarely used runway- Its happened to a lot of people on checkrides... I know of at least one that almost taxied on the active because he got confused and didnt know how he was supposed to go because he had never used that runway- one of the reasons the IP ended up unsatting him (the other was because he didn't verbalize to the IP that he saw a T-44 still on the runway when he was going to land and intended to use cnatra reduced mins- which is a dumb idea on a checkride or solo- or waveoff, and the IP thought he was going land). Another departed waldron incorrectly- another big nono. Those things along with busting the working should be easy to avoid with descent SA (but, I guess I was wrong for loading the working areas in the GPS as a backup as well)
On my SFS flights, the IPs asked me the entry procedures to the OLFs prior to starting the entry, I knew the procedures- but it was nice knowing that I could glance down at the little picture with the dotted lines all drawn out in case they asked me something non standard. during the ODO solo briefs I'd get asked if I knew the different VHF freqs in case my UHF **** the bed- I told them I didn't have them memorized, but showed them how I had my kneeboard setup. I never had any IP challenge my use of my kneeboard like that. A couple of them actually thought it was a good idea.
ccsv, you asked about ways to avoid course rules violations that would get you a down. Thats how I did it- I didn't realize trying to put all the tools they give you to good use to stay safe was that bad of an idea, (it seems to be percieved that way by some here). I never had any issues with it though. If you like my ideas but are unsure how they will be percieved, then ask your onwing, and talk to your checkride IP about it during the brief. If they don't want you to have any of that stuff to back yourself up and stay safe, just put it back in the blue brain, and put that in your map case.
jamnww said:
I think he's referring to the gayness of the no kneeboard gouge policy. It is a little ridiculous, any IP would be able to tell if someone was actually trying to use gouge to fly off of without knowing the procedures cold. The pauses to read each step of the procedure before you did it would give you away. I don't remember any real strict no gouge policy when I was in VT-2, but maybe there was. Most of the IP's in advanced were proponents of the 'if you aint cheatin' you, ain't tryin' philosophy, in other words making things easy on yourself. I guess its part of the harrasment package, similar to the gayness of drawing up systems diagrams on the briefing board.
I think it's a policy set in place so that determining what is or isn't "gouge" is set in stone - i.e., you can only have things that you were issued. Also, in advanced helos, there is no "inflight gouge" - just your PCL and the knowledge you bring to the flight.
zippy said:
nocal - thanks, thats what I was thinking but I wasn't sure...
everyone else - ok, yes there are ways that you "could" use gouge to run your flight...and yes you are supposed to treat your checkride like your solo BUT the IP will be looking that you can handle it from memory and expecting that on your real solo you will be able to back it up with other tools (including GPS and gouge). Its not practical to look down for each step of a procedure that you have gouged up, but I know some guys who would look down and refresh through the entire procedure before executing in the air. In case there is any doubt, this is improper use of gouge according to many instructors. Specific squadrons may or may not be strict about it but I can assure you that there will be some IPs who are, even in VT-2. To give an example, my on-wing told me the ONLY thing I could have in my blue brains till RIs was the comm frequency list with UHFs for everywhere and the VHF backups, and I was told not to use the GPS except on my actual solo.
squorch2 said:
Meh... can't speak for other communities, but most in the Rhino do it from memory-- I have a laminated, color-coded "cheat sheet" from MSWord that I keep on my kneeboard that I look at to make sure I don't miss anything... that's more typical.
PCL= for EPs.
Fly Navy said:
You say that like it wasn't my intent all along
On the AF side of the house, who is by the way notoriously more anal about stupid shiznit than the Navy side is, we did everything from memorization....it's called a flow...I think the majority of aircraft have one, whether you know it and use it or not. Obviously we used the checklist as a "make sure we did everything" list, but that's as simple as changing a page every 1/2 second and saying, "yup, this biatch is running." When you do the same stuff a trillion times, checklists are good for one thing, that little tab that says Emergency Checklist.
FLY_USMC said:
That's the thing with the PCL checklist. It doesn't work with the way things flow out on the ramp. Didn't in the T-45 and by the looks of it, doesn't in the Rhino. If you used the PCL, you'd be a@@holes and elbows figuring out what to do next. Believe me, I've already tried in the sim
