Rusty with calc, question about NUPOC

[Spekkio]

I posted on this forum a while back and got a lot of useful information regarding the Navy officer programs. I first went to the Navy as a way to pay my way through medical school and still do a good service to this great country. Well, unfortunately I didn't get accepted into med school (on two attempts) despite having a 3.71 GPA and scoring 88-92 percentile on the MCAT, so now I'm trying to search for other career options. Yep, medical school is THAT competitive, and I didn't want to go to med school out of the States. I still haven't sent in an application to the Navy yet, mostly because I couldn't do the run requirements up until recently. I've never been a fast runner, but after 6 months or so of working out and 20 lbs dropped I'm finally there. Still no speed demon, but I can exceed the minimum safely. Pushups and situps are no issue for me.

In the meantime, I've had a lot of time to think about all my options both military and civilian. My degree is in biology. Unfortunately, there's not a big market for biology majors in the civilian world. I've been finding this out the hard way as I've been searching for a respectable full-time job while I got myself in physical shape for the Navy. Currently I do private tutoring through Kaplan as a part-time job. Luckily that pays pretty decent and my parents have been nice enough to not kick me out of the house ... yet. After reading the tons of info on this site, I've come to the conclusion that I want to apply for the NUPOC program because I feel that program would put me on the best track towards career advancement either in or out of the military.

So here's the thing: I graduated college in January of this year. I placed out of calc I, so I never took it in college. Scored a 5/5 on the AP test. Class was easy as pie for me in H.S. when I took it -- I've always been very proficient at math and science. I thought my AP was good for calc II, but I'm now finding out that it wasn't. The thing is that I took this 5 years ago. I'm going to sign up to do calc II in a winter session. My physics was algebra-based, so I"ll be taking calc-based physics over a winter session as well and one in the spring.

My questions are: 1) Does calc II do a mini-review of calc I, or do they just pick up expecting you to be fresh out of calc I? 2) Same question about calc-based physics. 3) I may have to struggle at first in Calc II/Calc-based physics 1 while all the old stuff comes back to me, but am I going to be screwed if I get accepted into the NUPOC program when I have to take more advanced physics/engineering classes?

In other words, should I re-take calc I? Like I said, traditionally math and science haven't been much of a problem for me. I've heard that calc II isn't really all that much new material different from calc I anyway.

Final question: I've read people mentioning getting a masters while on shore duty as a Nuke officer. Is this realistic time-wise? In other words, does being on active duty make you strained for study time, or is it not too bad?

 

[Thisguy]

but am I going to be screwed if I get accepted into the NUPOC program when I have to take more advanced physics/engineering classes?

I took AB calc in High School and placed out of Calc I (BC calc is good for both I and II). From what I recall, Calc II pretty much picks up where calc I left off, though I do remember learning some of the calc II stuff in high school.

Not sure what your question above is asking...please clarify.

As for the masters, Nuke guys that do that are typically ROTC instructors or recruiters (my recruiter finished up his master's while on recruiting duty).

Also, Nuke Power school accounts for 12 credits (40%) of any engineering masters at Old Dominion U.

 

[Spekkio]

Thanks for the info on the masters thing. Since I'm not ROTC or an instructor, that probably means I won't be able to do it. It's always good to know what parts of the navy's "promises" are just blowing smoke up your ass.

At any rate, what I was asking is two things really: 1) is calc-based physics very calculus intensive, or is a basic rememberance of calc from 5 years ago enough to pass the class with at least a B? and 2) How calc-intensive is the training in the NUPOC program? Is this something I'll be using all the time, or does it focus more on the science aspect? Please spare me the philosophical "but you use the analytical reasoning in calc everyday!" debate that I've seen in other threads. Are you actually doing derivitives and integrals on a daily basis both in the program training and as a NTO?

Basically, I just wanted to know from people who took the classes if Calc II and/or calc-based physics takes any time out, even if it's just the first day, to review the basics from calc I. Also, I just don't want to create an uphill battle for myself for the duration of nuclear training because I took calculus 5 years ago. The thing is I thought that my calc test gave me Calc II because I got 3 credits for Calc I then 3 credits for "random math credit." I thought that "random math credit" was calc II, so having to just take calc II creates a time crunch. I guess that's the first lesson in paying attention to detail.

 

[Thisguy]

Thanks for the info on the masters thing. Since I'm not ROTC or an instructor, that probably means I won't be able to do it. It's always good to know what parts of the navy's "promises" are just blowing smoke up your ass.

Allow me to clarify. Those guys are Nukes who have done a fleet tour, and are on shore duty as either ROTC instructors or recruiters. Although I hear that recruiting is being taken over by the HR designator...nonetheless, ROTC should still be available to Nukes.

So no, they're not blowing smoke...my apologies for making it seem that way.

Also, I just don't want to create an uphill battle for myself for the duration of nuclear training because I took calculus 5 years ago.

Keep in mind, anyone that gets accepted to NUPOC is pretty far removed from calc, as for technical majors, you usually knock that out your freshman year of college. I can't speak for the actual classes though.

 

[Kathy]

I've heard that calc II isn't really all that much new material different from calc I anyway.

I know nothing about the NUPOC program, but I was a math major and placed out of Calc I via the AP test too. I did not have the option to place out of Calc II at my university, but I found that we had covered everything in Calc II in my high school Calc class so there was absolutely no new material.

 

[Spekkio]

@Kathy,

Thanks for the info. I know it's probably professor dependent, but I'll be taking the class at a local community college so I anticipate it not being too tough.

@Thisguy,

Thanks for the info regarding that. I'm a little confused though: do you mean that once you're done with your 3 year sea tour, you work on shore duty as a recruiter or instructor until you complete your 5 year obligation? Or do you have to specifically sign up to be a recruiter? I asked about a masters because I saw a few posters mention doing their masters while on shore duty while mining up old threads about NUPOC. I'm not expecting it to be easy, but I was just wondering if the job gets in the way of school too much to feasibly even consider it. Good point about most people being 3 years removed from calc anyway, I never really thought about that part.

The reason I suspected the Navy of "blowing smoke" is because my uncle was an enlisted in the Nuclear program. I don't know the details, but he has a very bad taste in his mouth towards the military because the Navy dicked him over on something when he left. When he heard I was going to apply to be an officer, his first reaction was telling me not to do it because "the government always screws you over." However, he seems to be in the minority. Most people who I talk to who served tell me to go for it. My ex-gf's cousin was an enlisted nuclear guy, never had an issue with the Navy, and he's now making 6 figures doing consultation work.

@all

Do you need the lab, too, for calc-physics, or just the class? I'll probably take the lab anyway, but damn I hate labs. Lots of writing and 2x the class time for 1 measley extra credit.

 

[Steve Wilkins]

Left Eye Lewie is very good at Calc....or so I've heard. :eyebrows_

 

[Thisguy]

@Thisguy,

Thanks for the info regarding that. I'm a little confused though: do you mean that once you're done with your 3 year sea tour, you work on shore duty as a recruiter or instructor until you complete your 5 year obligation? Or do you mean something else? I asked about a masters because I saw a few posters mention doing their masters while on shore duty while mining up old threads about NUPOC. Good point about most people being 3 years removed from calc anyway, I never really thought about that part.

Keep in mind that the nuclear training pipeline is part of your commitment, and easily takes about 1.5 years. So if you just want to do 5 and out, your obligation should be up after your first 3 year sub tour (it's different for surface nuke, they do a surface tour, go to nuke school, then do a nuke tour).

However, since the JO shore duty is pretty attractive, a lot of people get out after 7, because of the shore duty, and you get the year-to-year nuke bonus without committing to a 3-5yr additional commitment (if you do, the bonus is higher). You can still stay in and do department head school after that though.

As for physics lab, the requirement is 2 semesters of calc, 2 semesters of calc based phyics. I would take the lab, because at my school, Phys I didn't have a lab (but was 4 credits), and phys II had a lab (but was still 4 credits)

hope this helps

 

[Spekkio]

Yep, very helpful. I guess the only reason I'm worried about it is because I'm going to be doing at least Physics I over winter session, and I'm not sure they offer lab for it during that time. I didn't want to be stuck waiting to take Physics I lab because it's required for the Navy. If I have to take lab for one and not the other, it's no biggie for me. I've already had two semesters of Algebra physics with lab and I tutor the subject. Lab usually deals with what you just learned in class, anyway.

Thanks for the explanation on the shore duty. Didn't know you could just stay on for 2 extra years without actually signing on the dotted line for another 3-5. But, options at the end of the obligation are good. That's the whole reason the NUPOC program interests me in the first place.

 

[scoober78]

Also, Nuke Power school accounts for 12 credits (40%) of any engineering masters at Old Dominion U.

Are you sure about this? The impression I got from my Div-O was that it only applied to the Engineering Management masters from ODU...this was some time ago (4 years) so it might have changed or I could be senile...

 

[Thisguy]

Are you sure about this? The impression I got from my Div-O was that it only applied to the Engineering Management masters from ODU...this was some time ago (4 years) so it might have changed or I could be senile...

I'm pretty sure. I think a lot of people get the Engineering Master's because it's easy to do (I think it can be done distance ed), and most engineering masters require an undergraduate backround in some sort of engineering field. Alot of NUPOC guys my be Chem or math majors, plus you'll even find ROTC/USNA guys who weren't technical majors.

 

[Steve Wilkins]

Wow....lots of good stuff here.

If you placed out of Calc and you DO NOT have credit for Calc I on shown on your transcript, you will need to take Calc I for credit. You mentioned "winter session" which leads me to believe the school you are taking the coures from is on a quarter system (i.e. Fall, Winter, Spring quarters vs. Fall, Spring semesters). If the school is on a quarter system, you will need whatever Calc classes are taught during the three quarters. If it's on a semester system, then obviously you only need the two semesters.

The stronger you are in math and physics before you get to Power School, the better off you'll be. Here is my personal recommendation. Take Calc I, Calc II, and the first semster of calc based physics in one semester. If you don't need the Calc I for transcript purposes, I recommend taking it as an audit course (no grade) to help bring you back up to speed.

When you start Calc II, they're going to expect you know how to differentiate and do basic integrals (unless it's on the quarter system). Not really a big deal. It will come back to you and if you need help, seek out the professor.

I'll be taking the class at a local community college so I anticipate it not being too tough.

I wouldn't necessarily count on that. I took Calc I and II at Olympic College in Washington state a few years back when I thought I might want to teach HS math. The professor was a little older than I was and the courses were far more difficult than when I took them at a large university. AND....I would put him in the top 2 math teachers I've ever had. I don't think you'll have any problems though, I just don't want you to be overconfident and wind up surprised.

Yes, you need the lab with the physics.

About the masters degree. You can work on your masters degree anytime you want. You don't have to be on shore duty, though it tends to be a bit easier to do it then. Of course, it also depends on the type of masters degree you want to get.

 

[Steve Wilkins]

Yep, very helpful. I guess the only reason I'm worried about it is because I'm going to be doing at least Physics I over winter session, and I'm not sure they offer lab for it during that time. I didn't want to be stuck waiting to take Physics I lab because it's required for the Navy. If I have to take lab for one and not the other, it's no biggie for me. I've already had two semesters of Algebra physics with lab and I tutor the subject. Lab usually deals with what you just learned in class, anyway.

I'll reiterate in case it gets lost in my post above, but you need the physics lab. The lab that you took for algebra based physics won't count.

Thanks for the explanation on the shore duty. Didn't know you could just stay on for 2 extra years without actually signing on the dotted line for another 3-5.

Once you're commissioned, you're in until you request to get out, retire, or they kick you out. It's a much less passive system than it is for enlisted. Sign on the dotted line once.

But, options at the end of the obligation are good. That's the whole reason the NUPOC program interests me in the first place.

Options at the end of the obligation for other designators is pretty much the same as nuke.

 

[Spekkio]

Ok, I'll take the lab just to be safe.

The schools around here are on a semester system. "Winter session" refers to a 3-4 week condensed class, similar to summer sessions. You go to class for 4 hrs/day and if you miss one, you fail. Most schools do not give physics I or calc I in spring semester unless the school is sufficiently large to run the class. I'm going to be on the lookout for the different options, but I have to wait a couple of weeks until they come out with the class bullitens and the like.

I have 3 credit for calc I on my transcript, plus credit for MAT999 which translates to some random 3 math credits that the school doesn't have a direct class for. Weird, but w/e. I'm probably not going to re-take calc I. All I need is a condensed deritive and integral formula sheet, similar to the one we got for the high school class I took, for basic trig functions and I'll be ok by the 3rd day. Hopefully my professor will oblige me and help me make one. I'm actually more worried about calc-based physics than calculus itself, even though a lot of the calculus problems from my AP class were really physics questions.

Options for other unrestricted line designations in the Navy might be the same as NTO, but the options in the civilian world aren't. The job market is booming for people with engineer experience. That and nursing are the only two jobs I see available all the time around here that actually require a college degree. That could change in 5 years, but still you get the idea. I like learning and applying how things work as well as being in a position to make decisions. That's why I wanted to become a doctor. But since I didn't make the cut for med school and can't do that with people, I might as well do it with machines.