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Really??: Ten Thousand Feet and Ten Thousand Miles (A UAV Article)
- Thread starter ea6bflyr
- Start date
NC is the abbreviation for Navy Comm in the awards system, so that's what I used.
Hell, the way things are sliding, there are 3-yr. E-4s with more rows of ribbons than I rated in 22 years & 4 combat deployments in the '60s. One 12-month rear-area tour in the sandbox, is 2+ rows minimum. I don't begrudge them the awards, they are authorized... but it does water down the whole awards system. In my first 7 years of service I amassed 1.33 rows:What??? You don't think they deserve a Navy Cross????
1. National Defense (completed boot camp)
2. Navy Good Conduct (4 yrs. undetected crime as carefree 'white hat')
3. Navy Expeditionary w/ star (2 Westpac cold war cruises)
4. Navy European Occupation (1 North Atlantic cruise)
No complaints - No regrets!
BzB
The award system refers to Navy Cross as NX and Navy Comm as NC.
At this point, "awards" and "pins" are just career progression milestones, nothing more. Maybe I'm jaded (see my avatar), but who is honestly impressed with anyone's ribbons anymore? Completed a first tour? That should net you a Ronald McDonald for finishing USNA/ROTC/OCS, a piston qual for OOD inport, the GWOT playset, Sea Service, a NAM (unless you pissed your skipper off) and your pin, at minimum. All this for really just breathing onboard for 2+ years. Completed a second tour? Another NAM, a COM if you were loved, maybe a Battle E or Sea Service if you went out to sea again, anything else and you probably didn't do a traditional second tour (maybe a good or bad thing). Third tour or DH tour? A COM or else.
I'm I off base? I just don't see the arguement for "watering down" awards when most careers fall into that algorithm of award expectation. Rather, I see them a just a graphic of your career path that you were fortunate enough to walk, which ANYONE should have some sense of pride in regardless of what they wear at any given time.
I'm I off base? I just don't see the arguement for "watering down" awards when most careers fall into that algorithm of award expectation. Rather, I see them a just a graphic of your career path that you were fortunate enough to walk, which ANYONE should have some sense of pride in regardless of what they wear at any given time.
You mean like the four or five chop pins you all have? Smiles and all......
That's a pretty douch'y broadbrush statement, and a bitchslap to any bona fide combat veteran. Especially coming from a 'chop'.
Yes, you're off base. You don't see the "watering down" argument because this is the state of the only system you have known in your relatively brief time in the military. You weren't even thought of when awards were very few and far between, and were not sought, but were highly respected. Now, anyone who earned awards back in the day, are grouped with the disrespect you have for the same "did what I was paid for" awards expected today. Another difference in todays system, is that it has become customary for the new military to often actually put themselves in for an award, and often actually write up their own award. Anyone who might have had the nerve to attempt that back in my era, would have been hooted out of the ready room (although our new SecState got away with it). Alas, times have changed, and much of it for the good... I LOVE that the NAVAIR accident has improved by a factor of ~10. Given that, I'm lucky to be still alive!
As for your lack of respect for the "career milestone" pins, I hope your alluding to your own 5 flavors of 'chop' pins, because they pale next to NA/NFO Wings, Submarine Dolphins, and SWO Pins, which are much... much more than career milestones!
BzB
That's a pretty douch'y broadbrush statement, and a bitchslap to any bona fide combat veteran. Especially coming from a 'chop'.
Yes, you're off base. You don't see the "watering down" argument because this is the state of the only system you have known in your relatively brief time in the military. You weren't even thought of when awards were very few and far between, and were not sought, but were highly respected. Now, anyone who earned awards back in the day, are grouped with the disrespect you have for the same "did what I was paid for" awards expected today. Another difference in todays system, is that it has become customary for the new military to often actually put themselves in for an award, and often actually write up their own award. Anyone who might have had the nerve to attempt that back in my era, would have been hooted out of the ready room (although our new SecState got away with it). Alas, times have changed, and much of it for the good... I LOVE that the NAVAIR accident has improved by a factor of ~10. Given that, I'm lucky to be still alive!
As for your lack of respect for the "career milestone" pins, I hope your alluding to your own 5 flavors of 'chop' pins, because they pale next to NA/NFO Wings, Submarine Dolphins, and SWO Pins, which are much... much more than career milestones!
BzB
I'm sorry, I wear my uniform, my uniform doesn't wear me. No, I'm not going to look at a E-7 with a massive rack and think "Gee, General Patton has some catching up to do". I acknowledge we have indeed fallen into a "progression" system and every milestone that wasn't recognized during Patton's time feels a need to be recognized today. That doesn't take away from either man's accomplishments and you shouldn't need a ribbon or device to know that. The value of anyone's career is skin deep. And I will continue to serve for less superficial reasons than ribbons, but will see that E-7's rack and acknowledging his progress. Combat or otherwise. Thank you.
And I didn't talk down anyone's pins. Your insecurity does a good enough job at that. I'm not ignorant that NFOs and Pilots don't go to a day at the beach for their wings, but bust their ass. And God knows I know what SWOs dealt with, so you can relax.
I've studied POSTUMOUS Medal of Honors for Blacks who during the previous "system", didn't rate it. I read you loud and clear. That really brings my point full swing, the value of anyone's career is skin deep.
Your snide capitalization of a members typo, is notably classless.
BzB
Nice... personal attack, when there's no other reasonable response. Thanks for your service, out.
BzB
Wasn't intentional, twas in haste, but believe what you like. I've posted here for about 6 years and still consider myself a "guest" even today. I'm not here to disrespect anyone.
Nice... personal attack, when there's no other reasonable response. Thanks for your service, out.
BzB
I don't agree with that either, but at this point I'm willing to drop this one.
Spekkio
He bowls overhand.
Tiz, you might not have meant to insult warfare pins with this statement, but you did. Wings have been around for almost a century and dolphins not too far behind. Both devices were around in the "good old days" when award inflation reportedly didn't exist. There isn't a single submariner, officer or enlisted, who looks at his dolphins as "just another career milestone," nor is there one who will look at someone else with dolphins as if they were handed to him for meeting a few checks in the box. The endless NAMs and ribbons just for breathing onboard for a few years? Yea, not very highly regarded, but the pin is in an entirely different category.Tiz said:
Those who serve today know which awards are legit and which are handed out as an "attaboy" for doing an average job at one's assigned duties. Despite the NAM-flation, there are still awards that are meaningful. Some awards are even stingier -- it is nearly impossible to get awarded a Medal of Honor if the servicemember survives the encounter, which wasn't the case up through Vietnam.
I can only say that "I respect what you do, not what you wear" so many different times. As BzB said, I've moved on.