P3 Orion lifestyle

[Kaman]

LOL...Just giving you a hard time! I once was called to Maintenance Control by our AFCM because he had recieved a misuse and abuse chit from AIMD after a flight I was on. I used to fly on the H-2...OK, so I am dating myself here. Anyway, we were out with a group of FRPs and the HAC instructor was my boss (OPS O ) and we were old squadron-mates. Anyway, the RADAR (LN-66) started to act intermittently and my boss asked me if it was TU or could I get it working. Well, I re-cycled power, checked all connections, switches, CBs, re-cycled power as per our troubleshooting procedures...No workie...I kicked it around where the waveguide went into the R/T and it worked...Intermittently, I still had to kick it to get it to work. I told the AFCM the truth and the MO tore up the chit and told the CO. CO, was my old CO at HSL-37 and told the AIMD officer to stop sending non-RFI crap to our squadron. This wasn't the first time we got a bad RADAR R/T bad from supply. I was glad that the old man backed me up, but he was my CO in HSL-37 and had me explain how we lost a MAD bird after the reeling machine failed to change speeds. Not our fault...it was corrosion...
Anyway, FLY SAFE and all the best with the new baby. Kids are the greatest blessing in your life. I have a 7-year old, and she isn't so sure about Dad's sailor stories...LOL

Regards,

ex-Navy Rotorhead and PROUD LAMPS Mk. I AW

 

[tusk91]

Question for the P3 Aviators in the thread, I didn't see where this had been asked and answered any place else.

My question is approximately how many flight hours does it take to move through the ranks before making it to PPC or Pilot in command?

• Patrol Plane Commander (PPC)
• Patrol Plane 2nd Pilot (PP2P)
• Patrol Plane 3rd Pilot (PP3P)

The question may be naive on my part because I am assuming you can not log PIC time until reaching PPC.
Also, is it know whether or not the P-8 Poseidon will also fly with three(3) pilots as a part of the crew??

Just an idle question from a civilian who has a friend completing naval flight school at Vance and is trying to decide between the Helo's and P-3's community.

 

[zippy]

Question for the P3 Aviators in the thread, I didn't see where this had been asked and answered any place else.

My question is approximately how many flight hours does it take to move through the ranks before making it to PPC or Pilot in command?

• Patrol Plane Commander (PPC)
• Patrol Plane 2nd Pilot (PP2P)
• Patrol Plane 3rd Pilot (PP3P)

The question may be naive on my part because I am assuming you can not log PIC time until reaching PPC.
Also, is it know whether or not the P-8 Poseidon will also fly with three(3) pilots as a part of the crew??

Just an idle question from a civilian who has a friend completing naval flight school at Vance and is trying to decide between the Helo's and P-3's community.

PPC- 700hrs military pilot time
PPP (2p)- no real hours limit, but some squadrons have an in house rule of 400hrs
PPCP (3p)- completion of your squadrons stan check after you arrive from the FRS.

Word is that P-8 will continue to fly with 3 pilots.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again: DO NOT pick P-3s, or any other community for that matter, because you think its a quick and easy way to get hours to transition to the airlines. That will only set yourself up for a lot of disappointment. Pick the community for what you think you want to do in the Navy.

 

[tusk91]

Thanks for the response back and his final goal is actually not to go airlines but, to try and become a Naval Test Pilot. Of course, it is hard to tell how easy or hard that will be for him if he doesn't get selected for the "Tail hook" track and flies Hornets?

It certainly seems like if that doesn't happen the P-3/P-8 will make for a fantastic community.

 

[zippy]

Thanks for the response back and his final goal is actually not to go airlines but, to try and become a Naval Test Pilot. Of course, it is hard to tell how easy or hard that will be for him if he doesn't get selected for the "Tail hook" track and flies Hornets?

It certainly seems like if that doesn't happen the P-3/P-8 will make for a fantastic community.

I know two pilots from the P-3 community that got picked up for TPS in the last two years or so, and a couple more that are applying. It is possible from the P-3 community.

 

[tusk91]

Awesome, I will be sure to pass this information off to him. If he doesn't make the tail hook track then it may very well help him decide between Helo's and P-3's.

 

[HeyJoe]

Awesome, I will be sure to pass this information off to him. If he doesn't make the tail hook track then it may very well help him decide between Helo's and P-3's.

Why not have him register so it can take advantage of the gouge resident here?

 

[tusk91]

An even better idea!!!

 

[ScreamingEagle]

How tough a lifestyle can it be...NO tailhook, NO "elephant scabs, ravioli or sliders" at mid-Rats...AND, you get per diem! Oh, and the damned things can't hover either...

Are there a lot of VP types out there who came home from deployment rich based on the per diem they collected (except on those no per diem travel days we spent repoing for operations)? I usually came home with a little bit left, but spent most of what I collected on quarters, food, laundry, etc., and any miscellaneous expenses like club dues charged by the Air Force.

You're right about no mid-rats, but most of the places I went on VP deployments there were no rats available when we briefed at 2300 for a 0200 launch. As for hovering, well, not quite, but we did spend time hanging on the props when we were max conserve on fuel to be able to stretch out the time onsta. I do have to admit to being glad we didn't have a tailhook after watching any number of scary looking approaches on the PLAT during my carrier tour.

Having been out there for a couple of years on a carrier, I respect the tailhook and hookless hovering types for the conditions under which they operate and the way they perform their missions. I respect the VP types I knew and flew with, too. Different missions, different living conditions, but a high degree of professionalism all around.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

Agree completely. ISR isn't difficult. For a pilot it basically consists of: remember what direction the camera is pointed, don't go below the hard deck, don't fly into stand off, and don't fly into anyone else. If your crew is good at ASW, ISR isn't a huge transition. Personally, I found the ISR mission hugely rewarding and I've had buddies on the ground who've been grateful to have a P-3 overhead. I never thought I'd hear that from a Marine. And while I came into P-3s on the stories of my father spending deployment after deployment tracking Russian boats all over the world (I would kill to fly on just one, at this point), I'm perfectly content having been the eyes in the sky for my deployments.

I was one of the guys in a squadron that had one great deployment tracking a number of Soviet subs, but the point about the important contribution made by VP as "eyes in the sky" is well taken. I think the community forgets sometimes that its roots go back to being the eyes of the fleet, with surface reconnaisance and ASUW missions as necessary as ASW patrols.

The plane needs to have a relevant mission in order for the community to survive and be around when/if a strong sub threat re- emerges from a place like China, North Korea, Iran, a resurgent Russia, etc. You can see what happens when it seems apparent that the VP ASW mission isn't that critical and we go from 24 active squadrons (plus I don't recall how many reserve squadrons and squadron augment units) in the late 1980s to the 12 active squadrons today. (I realize budget decisions and downsizing the military played a role in that decrease as well.) I hate to think where the community would be today if an argument made by a respected VP tactician in the late 1970s for VP to only engage in strategic ASW missions (against Soviet SSBNs) had been followed.

 

[Kaman]

Look...2 o'clock...wait for it...IT'S A PER DIEM CHECK!!!!!

 

[Aquonox]

Sorry to resurrect the thread, but it seemed the most appropriate for my question (I looked through other threads and didn't find anything specific to what I am asking).

I understand that VP deploys via dets all over the place, but I was curious as to how often the crews get to have R&R/liberty and how long liberty usually lasts? For carriers, it seems to be around 1 port call per month for roughly 3-4 days from what I have heard/seen. (Again, they obviously vary depending on the deployment and carrier.)

Does the OIC of the det have a lot of influence over liberty on deployment? Are there watch standing positions like on a carrier?

I appreciate your help. I realize that there will probably not be one answer since the rules are different for the many deployment sites. I am not looking for a single answer anyways, I just want to hear what you VP guys have experienced with regards to liberty on deployment.

Thanks!

 

[Aquonox]

Oh, and I should add that this question can also be applied to anyone with other expeditionary deployment experience (MH-53, VAQ, etc.).

 

[zippy]

Sorry to resurrect the thread, but it seemed the most appropriate for my question (I looked through other threads and didn't find anything specific to what I am asking).

I understand that VP deploys via dets all over the place, but I was curious as to how often the crews get to have R&R/liberty and how long liberty usually lasts? For carriers, it seems to be around 1 port call per month for roughly 3-4 days from what I have heard/seen. (Again, they obviously vary depending on the deployment and carrier.)

Does the OIC of the det have a lot of influence over liberty on deployment? Are there watch standing positions like on a carrier?

I appreciate your help. I realize that there will probably not be one answer since the rules are different for the many deployment sites. I am not looking for a single answer anyways, I just want to hear what you VP guys have experienced with regards to liberty on deployment.

Thanks!

Local liberty policy will be IAW local and theater commander guidance. Whats that mean? Since P-3s go on det, their crews usually (outside of certain desert shithole locations) stay in local hotels, or on Air Force base Qs. That means after the end of the work day (whenever that ends up being), the Crews and maintainers are free to go back to where they are staying and relax... go to the pool, go eat, drink (until times dictated by Squadron, or OIC guidance), gym, whatever they want. In certain locations, there are liberty restrictions that limit abilities to go anywhere they want in a foreign country at will. Depending on ATFP status, local agreements, Squadron policy etc liberty buddies may be required and curfews may be enforced (ie you shall sign a logbook reporting your departure, the number in your liberty party, who the senior member is, who the sober member [generally a requirement] is and perspective location, and then sign back in reporting your return prior to the curfew). Exceptions to these may be Embassy, Local commander approved tours or trips to locations inside a country where certain parts are off limits.

Short answer is that you get liberty whenever you aren't at work or on duty. Sometimes there are restrictions on where you can go and what time you have to be back at the place you're staying but you tend to get a lot more exposure to the host nation than you would during a few day port call because you're there longer. That is, of course, unless someone in your group, or the group prior fucks up big time and you're restricted to spending the entire stay in a hotel or on base on lockdown... then the carrier crews get more exposure and better liberty (although if the situation is that bad, they usually won't let a boat make a port call to that location).

 

[Aquonox]

Local liberty policy will be IAW local and theater commander guidance. Whats that mean? Since P-3s go on det, their crews usually (outside of certain desert shithole locations) stay in local hotels, or on Air Force base Qs. That means after the end of the work day (whenever that ends up being), the Crews and maintainers are free to go back to where they are staying and relax... go to the pool, go eat, drink (until times dictated by Squadron, or OIC guidance), gym, whatever they want. In certain locations, there are liberty restrictions that limit abilities to go anywhere they want in a foreign country at will. Depending on ATFP status, local agreements, Squadron policy etc liberty buddies may be required and curfews may be enforced (ie you shall sign a logbook reporting your departure, the number in your liberty party, who the senior member is, who the sober member [generally a requirement] is and perspective location, and then sign back in reporting your return prior to the curfew). Exceptions to these may be Embassy, Local commander approved tours or trips to locations inside a country where certain parts are off limits.

Short answer is that you get liberty whenever you aren't at work or on duty. Sometimes there are restrictions on where you can go and what time you have to be back at the place you're staying but you tend to get a lot more exposure to the host nation than you would during a few day port call because you're there longer. That is, of course, unless someone in your group, or the group prior fucks up big time and you're restricted to spending the entire stay in a hotel or on base on lockdown... then the carrier crews get more exposure and better liberty (although if the situation is that bad, they usually won't let a boat make a port call to that location).

Thank you very much. The "exposure time" is what I was not sure about. The longer time in the host nation is what interests me as I really want to travel and see the world in addition to performing the mission. Also, you get to go to more than one det site on a single deployment if I am not mistaken? (again, probably depends on where you are deploying to)