Just enlisted, going in as E-3, I want gold wings

[twidget]

Congrats BigMike, glad it finally paid off for you. I'm in the same boat, it just took me a little longer. I came in with no college and took 12 years to finish my degree and get accepted. It's going to make the day we put on the butter bars all the sweeter, from having slugged it out in the trenches for so long.

"He possesses the one thing that the direct commissions may pretend, but can never attain: the sure knowledge of what goes on in the hearts and minds of enlisted men..."

-Gerald P. Averill

See you in April!

 

[sludge31]

I was non select for NFO/Intel/Oceanography last year with a 62/7/6/7 ASTB, 3.5 GPA Biology...decided to take the ASVAB and scored 99...enlisted January 14 as Nuke with a ship date in May...a week later Officer recruiting calls and asks me if I am still interested in going NFO...HELL YEA...went down for PRT and got a prorec...still waiting on final selection...you guys are making me nervous...I also got the impression that getting to OCS from the "inside" might be a better route to take...if all else fails, at least I will get to be a Nuke...Any thought on why the whole process went down this way?...could my enlisting have had anything to do with my prorec from the aviation board?...I will hand up and listen to your response...

 

[Steve Wilkins]

I don't know anything about your prorec, but I will tell you that there is absolutely nothing glamorous about being a nuke. The school is hard, quals are hard, life is hard. First on the boat, last off. You are simply biting yourself in the ass by enlisting. With a little patience and perseverence on your part, you have a good chance of achieving your goals (Dave Shutter from this board comes to mind). Especially with a 3.5 GPA in Biology. I guess for you, it doesn't matter because you got the call from the officer recruiter. However, there are others out there just like you that I am speaking to.

 

[Fred]

Originally posted by Steve Wilkins
I don't know anything about your prorec, but I will tell you that there is absolutely nothing glamorous about being a nuke. The school is hard, quals are hard, life is hard. First on the boat, last off.

You paint such a pretty picture of Nuke power Steve.

My husband leaves for Nuc school in SC next month. He is excited about it and eager to get the school portion behind him.
It's going to be a long almost two years though. The kids and I are not going with him since he will be moving every 4-6mo.

 

[Joker853]

I honor everything you guys say, and believe everything. Regarding the gpa thing, I left something out. When I said that I don't have the gpa for it, it doesn't imply I'm not smart enough. Basically, I didn't apply myself in college, duped myself into thinking I was trying my hardest.

I was motivated in school to learn, and not as much to make a grade. I went to class, learned the material, knew the material, and blew off the tests. I really didn't realize I was doing this until my senior year of college. Basically, my motivation for college was to learn everything I could, not try to get a grade. When I felt I learned the material, I had no motivation for the grade. Thank god I know where I messed up. Regarding the Navy? I won't let myself do this. School doesn't require me to protect my country; The armed services do. I will not fail at this, will give my all.

As for enlisting first, I have heard otherwise from many different people, both officers and enlisted, including recruiters. I didn't have the gpa for OCS. Everyone I've talked to in the Navy has told me that once you go thru boot, and then thru A-School, and then finish the degree, then I could apply for OCS.

Now I know there are no guarentees, and I expect not to get in right away. But I know what I've been told by both you guys here at the forum, and friends who have actually went through it and whom I talk to on a weekly basis.

Either way, I am enlisted in the Navy. I ship out July for boot, then A-school to be an AC (Air Traffic Control) in Pensacola, and then hopefully the job I want. As for being a pilot, maybe I don't have what it takes to cut it.

I do have a question Steve. When you say "quals," I'm guessing you are talking about qualifications. What does this mean? Like I said before, someone on here has to have aim or msn. I just need someone to sit down and talk to via chat client.

I have nothing but respect for everyone responding to this matter as well as everyone in a branch of the armed forces, all of your input is greatly appreciated

Regards,
Jesse

 

[webmaster]

Jesse,

Good to hear about the self assessment on what you were doing in college. I realized in high school that I didn't have the maturity or study habits to make college worthwhile for me (I was offered an Academy slot, accepted to Georgetown and I hate to say it being a Gator, but FSU also...). Also, the same as Steve, there was also a financial angle involved if I didn't take the Academy route. So I enlisted right after high school, and fast forward 13 years later I am now a LT in the Navy, and a Pilot. I just want to point out that we are not trying to discourage you from the enlisted to officer route. Just be aware that it isn't a quick and easy thing that may be portrayed to you by the recruiter.

In many ways you are going to be the "old man" in your training, with others just out of high school, and you also having a degree, in a way setting you apart. Many of the leadership you encounter will identify you early for increased responsibility. This is the time to shine, and take advantage of it, to set yourself apart, and get started on the road for a competitive commissioning package.

Some things to consider while working your way towards your goal, I am sure some other mustangs have some other thoughts along these lines (or keys to succss):

- Take the hard jobs, do them well. The go to guy.
- Don't shirk responsibility.
- Look after your peer and subordinates.
- Take the extra time to square your uniform away (impressions count).
- Be on time. If you are ever late, you would rather have your CPO saying, "Something must be wrong, he is NEVER late"
- Qualify early, seek out higher quals and watchstanding as applicable.
- Positive attitude.

Your eventual goal as stated is OCS and Wings. But as mentioned, you have many other hurdles to overcome in the interim. Focus on each of those in turn, and before you know it, you will be there.

All the best, and have fun on 1-5 day.... though I don't think that exists in A school anymore... sadly...

 

[wytee44]

I have to agree with everyone saying not to enlist just for the sake of becoming an officer. I enlisted for the sole purpose of getting the GI Bill to finish school. But once I got to my cruiser out of Pearl Harbor, I worked my butt off and got every qual I could plus a couple that they wouldn't at first let me have (a YN2 with a OOD Underway letter). The point I'm trying to make for those that don't have good college GPA's (a blistering 1.9 for me) is that you still have a chance for a commission. I took classes after I enlisted, make sure I got good grades, and applied for the Seaman to Admiral Program (the old program when they only took 50 a year). I didn't think I had a chance with my crappy GPT, but with my evals, quals and recent school work, I was selected my first time applying. I'm currently in jet training in Meridian and should get my wings in October. If you enlist or are enlisted and want your wings, READ THE LAST POST OVER AND OVER. Every successful mustang has used those rules to a T on a daily basis.

 

[Vandy7]

As yet another one of the "Don Quixotes" who enlisted to become an officer and then achieved that goal, I agree with pretty much all that has been said. You really don't want to do it unless it is truly the only way.

If you do it because of money (lack thereof), that is one thing. You will eventually achieve your goal, if you are young enough and motivated enough--though you may not be in the military anymore when you actually get picked up for a commission and/or finish your degree. (I think the selection boards like ex-military guys because they are getting someone who knows what he/she is getting into and who also has something of a military track record they can look at it, as compared to the no-experience "Joe College" grad.) But I still think it is far better to stick it out and eat Ramen noodles every day for four years and get a real degree from a real school--if you have a good GPA. I don't mean this negatively, but, unfortunately, too many of the degree options available for active duty enlisted just aren't prestigious/rigorous enough to compete against that college guy graduating from UCLA/Berkely/USC/Ga Tech etc-- and that is who you are competing against for OCS slots. STA-21 is, of course, a lot different.

A degree from Southern Illinois and the like is definitely something to take pride in, but the ugly little truth is that America is becoming a place where it is not only if you have a bachelor's, but where it is from. In our lifetime it will probably be if you have a master's or not. I am convinced that the fact that I had a Mech E. degree from Ga. Tech helped me a lot when I was a STS3(SS) applying for OCS--even though I had a lousy GPA. (It was of the slacker A..F..W..A..F type, not the C..C..C GPA type.)

If, like I did, you enlist because of a bad GPA, that is another thing entirely. Enlisting is then basically a "Hail Mary" play to rescue a mediocre (or worse) college performance/career start. That was, once again my case. What you are trying to show the Navy is that you were "Joe Idiot" back then but are "AJ Squared-Away" now--a person who is a safe bet to excel and successfully complete officer training and warfare qualification. You can best do that by excelling in RTC, A school, initial duties, etc, as well as learning as much as you can about the ENTIRE service you are in.

The earlier comments by the webmaster above apply. (I was once not only late for work-- because of oversleeping--but we had quarters on the pier that morning, and they had an award for me which I of course wasn't there for. Had been on board for only three months and it could have been a disaster. But since I had already cemented a rock-solid reputation as being a great sailor--absolutely nothing was said.) You are trying to show that you are officer material. Make sure you are--which means that you are not going to just have to excel, but really really excel, especially if you want to pick up an officer program within 2-3 years, vice 4-7.
Quals have been mentioned. They are important. You are being paid to do a job. You need to be on the enlisted superstar/waterwalker fast-track. Honestly, that means the college degree needs to take a back seat for the first year at least, if not longer. Another good reason to finish that degree outside the Navy if you can. Starve, become a male gigolo, whatever, but get that diploma in your hands. It may be the quicker route, also, because I'm going to guess the Army/Marine grunts in Iraq/Afghanistan aren't racking too many credits up right now. And PACE notwithstanding, it is still hard to get classes done on sea duty.

I also have a post elsewhere that is applicable. It is also a magnum opus, so I won't repeat it here.

So, in summary--enlisting is a very good option if you are doing it because of a bad GPA--your only other realistic chance is going to grad school and getting a masters (IF you can get in), and letting that GPA trump your bachelors, just as college trumps high school. Assuming, of course, that you can break out of your evil college slacker ways. Otherwise, if you are broke, enlisting is still not a bad option--just realize that even if you don't get picked up while you are in, it may still count in your favor later down the road--IF your record is a good one (not average, but a GOOD one), and you are still young enough. And of course, you will have money then, and can complete your degree, so that even if you never get picked up, you will have served with honor (in wartime) and your life will be off to a good start. While the world does need ditchdiggers, Danny, you won't be one of them.

 

[Joker853]

Wow, this turned out to be a pretty big thread eh? Ok, after reading all that, my brains are mush.

The main reason I joined the navy was that I wanted direction in my life. I could have stayed in college an additional year, and graduated a 5 1/2 year senior. Even if I did graduate with a degree, It still wasn't completely what I wanted.

I then thought of OCS. Talked to the Marine recruiters and the Navy recruiters. The Marine guy told me that I needed a 2.0 to be accepted OCS, but he seemed a little shady. I AM NOT DISSING THE MARINES, my dad was a marine, and there is nobody else I'm prouder of. The recruiter just seemed to be blowing smoke, as sometimes they can do.

Talked to the Navy recruiter, he told me I didn't qualify for OCS. I asked for finishing my education in the Navy. He told me they'd give me up to 12 hours a semester, and some colleges would like at my 130 hours and give me a degree.) He didnt tell me it would be a piece of cake getting into OCS, but I would have at least a slight chance.

So I talked to friends in San Diego, both Marine and Navy, and I chose the Navy based on my personality type.

After getting my rate as an AC, was told since it was a "clean" job in aviation, I would have more of a chance. Again, weary of this advice.

So here's where we're at. I ship out in mid-July. I recieved an 89 on my ASVAB, but that's all I've taken so far. Already know more than what I need to for boot, with 5 months to go. I'm at the gym every other night, running 7 minute miles (getting better every week) and getting myself in shape. I have been told Air Traffic Control is a great job, though stressful, but I've been under high stress my whole life (gunnery sgt. for a dad)

Even if it does take awhile to get into OCS, when I get out of the Navy, Air Traffic Controllers don't make to shabby of a living. So at this point, my ultimate dream is to fly, but I guess just working with you flyboys is pretty damn cool too

Thanks for all your input, you guys kick ass!

 

[jca320]

I honor everything you guys say, and believe everything. Regarding the gpa thing, I left something out. When I said that I don't have the gpa for it, it doesn't imply I'm not smart enough. Basically, I didn't apply myself in college, duped myself into thinking I was trying my hardest.

GPA is important. Yes, you may have learned what ever it was that you were studying but you lacked long term planning skills.

Now I know there are no guarentees, and I expect not to get in right away.

I met a girl when taking the ASTB. She is doing the same thing as you. It still doesn't make sense to me. I wouldn't want to risk being stuck as enlisted when OCS is a possibility.

Thinking about it a bit more I can see how being enlisted gives a first hand experience of people you are to lead.


Good luck to you. I'll be honored to serve with you when I get in.

John

 

[usnavy_mustang]

Joker I have some advice if your willing to listen. I'm telling you now...as a prior Chief now turned Ensign it is extremely hard to make the transition. As on of the posts mentioned earlier, "How bad do you want it?" It took me 12 years to finally get my commission and now that I'm in HT's looking back it was a royal pain to get where I'm at now. You mentioned a GPA problem. I could be wrong but as I see the actual instruction there are NO GPA requirements. You will eventually have to send you package to a board to review you qualifications (as you may already know). No matter whether you are a civilian or a current military member you still send the package to a board. The board will still review your college transcripts. You biggest influence on the board is how you do during an oral board. I'm just here to let you know, if you're looking at making it through the enlisted ranks first, it will be much tougher than you think. Your best bet is to contact an "Officer" recruiting station and stop talking to the enlisted recruiters. You're getting bad "gouge." I understand you think you are "committed" to boot camp as of this moment, but I'm telling you now...there are ways around that too. If your goal is to become a Naval Officer, I would not waste time, especially if your anywhere near the age limits. These are ONLY my oppinions. Take them for what they are worth. If you care to contact me you may email me and I'll answer any questions you may have.

 

[twidget]

Mustang, glad to see there's someone else with as much time as me who finally got picked up.

I absolutely agree with you about the difficulty in receiving a commission as an enlisted. All the programs I've applied for have been EXTREMELY competitive. Though I was too old to apply for the STA21 program once it was revamped, I applied for the old Seaman-to-Admiral program the first 2 years it was introduced. There were so many 2nd/1st Class Petty Officer's this program appealed to, it garnered an avalanche of apps. I think there were 3-4000 apps for 50 spots.

I also applied to LDO 3 times, this year would have been my 4th, but I got selected for OCS so they cancelled my app. It's a damn good thing I always had a back-up to my back-up plan, or I would have gotten too old by the time I figured out the LDO/CWO thing wasn't going to happen for me.

When I first knew being an officer was the way to go for me, I never dreamed I'd get all the way to my last ditch option before getting selected. My plan was to apply for STA twice, until I got to old (27 was the cut-off) and start taking college classes. If that didn't work, I'd wait the 2 years time-in-rate as a First and start applying for LDO, still taking classes. If that didn't work, I'd make Chief, keep applying for LDO and throw in CWO for good measure, and keep taking classes. If that didn't work I'd finish my degree and go OCS. That was about 9 years ago.

When you're a $hit-hot, hard-charging second class with 3 years in, you figure with hard-work, initiative, and the right attitude, a commission is pretty much a done deal. I was wrong as could be, but luckily I hoped for the best, but planned for the worst.

I'll hit 13 years a few weeks before I go to OCS this April.

What the heck was that all about, did you really need a life story? Probably not. So, like I was saying:

It is not easy to get a commission as an enlisted!

You're not shipping out till July, right Joker? You say you don't have the GPA to get in to OCS. Has anyone told you...it's FREE to apply! What's it gonna hurt? Spin the wheel, you can't win if you don't play!

 

[Steve Wilkins]

Joker I have some advice if your willing to listen. I'm telling you now...as a prior Chief now turned Ensign it is extremely hard to make the transition.

Joker, I hope you focus in on the key word here....."Chief"

This will be a word you become intimately familar with....hopefully not in a bad way....but intimately none the less.

 

[usnavy_mustang]

Hey thanks Steve I appreciate that. I also agree with Twidget. I once started applying for the old STA program about the third year into it (when they were only accepting 50 people a year). Needless to say, I didn't get picked up. I was kind of a kick in the sack. I had to pick myself up and decide if I was going to do it, I had to go about it another way. I finished my degree December of 2001, applied in January, got picked up for OCS in Feb/Mar and shipped off in October when they finally got money to send all us old folks along. The point here is, you will be told by many people that making a transition from the enlisted ranks will be easy. It's very easy to hear that from someone who hasn't made the transition. Truth is, I haven't talked to one person that said, "Oh yeah I had an easy time doing it." Secondly, if you wait and apply from the outside, you're not scrubbing toilets for the next six years trying to get in. Like I said before, this is only advise take it or leave it, but before you make a split decision, talk to someone (not just one or two, talk to many) who have been there. Whethere someone made it or not, if you talk to someone who has been there, a real sailor will tell you what he/she has actually ben through. Anyway/anyhow you do it....whatever you do...don't give up. If you get denied, try again. I wish you the best of luck.

 

[cricechex]

Well, I enlisted too! You all have given much to think about. I currently have a 3.1 GPA and my associate's degree finished. I will be leaving for boot in May. I took a five year enlistment which will put me at age 27 when this is done. Would it be a good idea to get out, finish my degree, and then apply for OCS. OR, if I am done with my BA by then, still get out and apply?

Also, what degree should I go for? Is there an Embry Rhiddle satelite compass at Oceana? If so, would that be that best place to get a degree from?

In case people want to know why I even depped in, it is because I want to get disciplined and get keep my eyes on my goal! Everytime I see a jet I am awh inspired, VERY MOTIVATED! Working around these things will help me to see why I should work just a little harder even when my will is to slack off. I will be and AME, hopefully working on F/A18's out of Oceana.
Thanks for the help.