Is it wise to get civilian flight training before API?

[IrishEagle85]

I'm a MIDN 1/C, still fairly new to these forums. I'm designated as 1390, the actual orders haven't shown up yet.

I was meeting with our Aviation LT the other day who is a P-3 pilot. He was telling me it would be in my best interest to log in as many hours as I could through a PPL program prior to starting API. His reasoning, he said, was so "You're first time being graded in Primary won't be the first time you've flown an aircraft."

On the other hand, I've heard from a couple of O-5's and O-6's in the Naval Aviation community that while it's good to get some familiarization with the instruments through civilian training, they recommended against spending too much time in civilian training in order to keep from picking up bad habits, which might hurt me in Primary.

Now, I have a friend in the dorms who happens to be a certified pilot instructor. He's willing to give me lessons for only the cost of renting the plane and the cost of fuel ($80/hr).

So my question is this; is it wise to pay to get some flight hours through a civilian program? Also, I had heard that the Navy was now sending SNA's through a civilian program prior to API to make sure they had the aptitude t be a pilot, although my LT told me the Navy is only doing this with about half of the SNA community. Can anybody clarify?

Thanks,
Dave

 

[UMichfly]

Sorry to say it but the LT is full of lots of bad gouge. While I'm sure some prior training couldn't hurt when it comes to Primary, it's by no means necessary. You WILL get 25 hours flying with a civilian flight school during IFS so you won't be hitting primary with 0 clue about flying. The topic of prior training has been covered ad nauseam on here and can be found pretty easily using the search function ;-).

 

[usmarinemike]

I think your LT is making stuff up. The first thing you do when you go to Pensacola is about 20 hours of civilian flight time before you go to API. There are O-1s who don't do it, but they're the ones that have the flight time already.

Do a search for IFS. That's the program you'll be going through after you graduate in a few weeks.

Bottom line: Don't waste your time and money.


Edit: UMich beat me to it. Still though....Don't do it.

 

[loadtoad]

It is not something you really need to waste your money on. I didn't do IFS but from my understanding it really isn't graded at all. I know that the scores in IFS (if there is any) don't go into any selection process...

However, flying those beaters around is a lot of fun. If your buddy is going to teach for free and you can rent a plane wet for $80 I say go for it and get a few hours. It's a lot of fun and will give you an idea what your in for.

 

[IrishEagle85]

OK, thanks for the advice guys. Sorry if that was already addressed in a different thread ;-)

 

[MIDNJAC]

Now in the defense of your LT's suggestion, the advantage of having some flight experience before checking in is that (if you meet req's) you won't need to do IFS. This will prevent you from:

A) Sitting in A-pool for an eternity (weeks vs. months from what I hear)
B) Having to commute from NAS every day that you are in IFS, only to find out after an hour drive that your flight is cnx for weather/maintenance/etc.

I know this isn't the reasoning your LT gave you, but it is something to think about. Not sure if the price of doing it on your own makes this not worth it. If you want to fly though, why not start now if you have the money and time to do it? Just remember that things will be different when you learn down here.

Now a word of caution....if you take your CFI friend up on his offer, make sure that his rental contract at whatever FBO you go to doesn't prohibit 3rd party instruction (which it in almost all cases it WILL). This proposition is probably a pipe dream unless he is going to give you instruction in a privately owned aircraft with the owner's consent.

 

[FlyMikeFly]

I say go for it, any flight training you can get prior to starting in Pensacola will make it that much easier for you to understand the material, it takes the guys who have no worthwhile aviation experience at all (IFS) a little longer to catch on. Having prior flight time only helps you so much though, but I think it is well worth it. Plus, flying General Aviation is a blast!

 

[IrishEagle85]

I say go for it, any flight training you can get prior to starting in Pensacola will make it that much easier for you to understand the material, it takes the guys who have no worthwhile aviation experience at all (IFS) a little longer to catch on. Having prior flight time only helps you so much though, but I think it is well worth it. Plus, flying General Aviation is a blast!

I'm actually heading to the airport in 5 minutes for my first lesson. I don't have the money or the necessary time left before API to qualify for a PPL, but hell, it's hanging out with a friend and trying something new with my afternoon. I figure I can shell out for 4-5 hours for a couple of shits and giggles.

Edit:
That was a ton of fun. After about a two hour lesson (one hour on the ground, 45 minutes in the sky), I only paid $40 in all.

 

[FlyMikeFly]

Enjoy it man!

 

[FLYTPAY]

O-5's and O-6's....they recommended against spending too much time in civilian training in order to keep from picking up bad habits, which might hurt me in Primary.

I don't buy the "bad habit" arguement.

 

[IrishEagle85]

I don't buy the "bad habit" arguement.

Yeah, I don't get exactly what they were getting at. I'm going to go up a couple more times just because it was damned fun, but it won't be that much longer before I hit IFS/API anyways.

 

[FLY_USMC]

The "bad habits" gouge is retarded. If you got some $$ that you'd like to spend, go flying by all means.

 

[Tom]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principles_of_learning#Primacy

 

[kmac]

The "bad habits" gouge is retarded. If you got some $$ that you'd like to spend, go flying by all means.

It seems that the habits that are hard to break come from the guys with 100s if not 1000s of hours already. I can't say that I have a lot of experience flying with these guys, but even as a fleet guy coming back to training command I had "bad habits." It's all relative.

 

[FLYTPAY]

It seems that the habits that are hard to break come from the guys with 100s if not 1000s of hours already. I can't say that I have a lot of experience flying with these guys, but even as a fleet guy coming back to training command I had "bad habits." It's all relative.

I cannot think of an example of a "bad habit" you learn flying a Cessna. Basic Airwork? Aero? Instruments? VNAV? FAMS? The training program is so canned and procedurally intensive that you cannot have a habit=technique. Going back through Whiting and having to do the retard comms, made my abbreviated/fleet/tactical comms a "bad habit". Get the experience in the air for the fun of it. DO not think that your flying for a $100 hamburger is going to help you because the cadence and conduct of the flights in Primary and advanced are 100% different.