Interested in USMC Aviation.

[akoni78]

Hello,

I am interested in becoming a USMC fighter pilot, but I am a beginner and I have a few questions. Let me explain my situation first. I recently graduated (5/02) from with a Bachelors degree in Computer Science. I am currently working full time as a software engineer (making good bucks too!), but I have always had a passion to be a fighter pilot. I would really love to fly the Hornet (and from what I read, I am not the minority!). So, I am basically at square one (except I have a four-year degree in a technical field). I have to admit that my biggest concern is the risk involved with joining. There is no garentee that I will be able to fly the Hornet. I don't mean to sound flaky, but I do have a good career and I would be taking a risk by joining. My questions are:

- Can they garentee someone like myself an "air" slot, before I agree to join?

- Does an "air" slot imply that you will definately be an aviator (assuming you pass your tests and such) and not become and NFO or something?

- Do they have programs to pay of collage loans (since I was not ROTC or anything)?

- If for some reason, I don't get to fly, would they place me at a Computer job (since I have a CS degree)? Also, if this situation occurs, would I still be held into the 8-10 yr contract?

- What is the sequnce of events I would have to go through? (Is it: boot camp, PFT, OSC, TBS, API, Primary, Intermediate, Advanced) and how long would this process take (including "wait times" and/or "delays")?

- Am I too old to begin? (I am 23. turning 24 in December)

-Do I have a disadvantage (in terms of flying) going in without having done ROTC???

Sorry for so many questions but, this will be a huge decision for me and if I do it, it will be because I want to become a USMC fighter pilot (which I believe is where I belong), not a USMC software engineer, not a USMC Helicopter pilot (not to put those positions down at all). Try to understand that I would be giving up my position as a Commercial SOftware Engineer (mucho $$$) in order to do this, and I wouldn't give that up unless I could fly fighter jets. Please do not take this the wrong way, I do not mean to put down any other career paths...this is just my personal feeling. Thanks in advance for your response.

Aloha,

akoni78

 

[Grandmaster235]

Yes, they can guarantee you a pilot slot (as opposed to NFO or anything else). BUT - they won't guarantee you a specific aircraft type!! You may "believe" you "belong" in a fighter, but CNATRA may "believe" otherwise.

No, they will not pay an officer's student loans.

No, you're not too old.

No, you're at no disadvantage - OCS produces better officers than ROTC anyway.

The rest of your questions can better be answered by someone wearing green!!

Good luck!!

Grandmaster 235

 

[E5B]

akoni,

In the Corps, you are an infantry officer FIRST, pilot second. You're going to do time in the field, your going to do humps, and yes, you will train in the rain. It's best to think long and hard about what you want to do. If you really want to be a MARINE then find an OSO and get after it. If all you want to be is "just a fighter pilot" you may want to reconsider joining the Corps. Grandmaster answered all your questions. Everyone wants to fly fixed wing, so keep in mind the chances of you getting Helo's are pretty high, not to mention about %75 of Marine Corps pilots are Helo pilots anyway. Thats what I'm shooting for...helo's here I come. Good luck, and hope this helps, feel free to ask more ?'s

"You forgot your furtune cookie"

Dirty Harry

 

[akoni78]

Thank you for your prompt replies. I must say, it is relieving to hear that I can potentially be garenteed a pilot slot. However, it is somewhat discouraging to hear that I will likely become a Helo pilot. What does it take to get "Jets" in the USMC? an NSS of over 70 or somthing? I read in other topics that the Marines are "hurting" for aviators (is this just in the sense of Helos?). If I were to get Jets out of primary...what are the odds of from that point getting Hornets (in other words, are you likely to get Hornets, as opposed to say Prowlers or Harriers, if you get Jets)?

From what I read, the Navy os overcrowded with aspiring "top gunners" (which is partly why I looked to the USMC). Are your odds of getting Jets better with the Navy? Air Force? How about the odds of NOT getting Helos (again, nothing against Helo pilots)?

What I am trying to do is logically gain confirmation that getting myself into a Hornet would require more skill than luck. I am confident that I can perform (subjective , but I would hate to think that it may come down to the old "luck of the draw" (in a sense). I want to know that if I out-perform the next man, my shots are higher. (As opposed to "striving for mediocricy" or relying on plain old luck).

Also, I thought the Marines only fill two slots when selecting platform out of Primary (as opposed to three in the Navy). Why not just put Jets, then Props (and not include Helos as a choice). I hear you will usually get your first or second choice...

Finally, I forgot to add in my last post that, first and foremost, of course, it would make me proud to serve as an officer in the USMC. Thanks again for the information.

 

[Grandmaster235]

There's no way to tell what the selection picture will look like when you finish Primary. There might be a "Jet draft" that week and every swinging richard gets jets, or there might be no slots available. That being said, performance does count, because those who are ranked higher have first dibs on what they want, IF IT'S AVAILABLE. The Corps doesn't owe you or anyone an F/A-18 slot. Some of the best instructors I had in flight school were USMC helo drivers.

Navy selection works the same way. Air Force? Who knows/cares...

Grandmaster 235

 

[akoni78]

Can you wait until a week when there is a "Jet Draft" to go? or do you automatically get whats available the week you finish primarys?

To think that your entire aviation career relies on the luck of one particular weeks draw!

How often are there "Jet Drafts"? How can you tell if a "Jet Draft" is near?

Thanks again. (Nice comment about the Air Force. haha)

 

[Sammie]

No, obviously you can't wait a week because then everyone would!

If you want to guarantee jets (or Hornets for that matter) get that 70 NSS and they will find you a slot. Hard work plus a little natural skill will get you there.

 

[akoni78]

Thanks Sammie, but how can they "find me a slot" if it is solely based on what is available the particular week I graduate? Are you saying that exceptional performers can wait a week or two for the "jet" slot?

Or could the following scenario occur:

3 pilots graduate in week one, all with NSS above 60 (one with 70). They all have Jets as their first choice but it just so happens that only Helos are available that week. They all get sent to become Helo pilots.

Week two arrives and 2 pilots graduate, one with NSS 53 and the other with NSS 55. They also both want Jets and it just so happens two Jet slots are open. The both get Jets.

Sorry about being so hard-pressed, I just really want to know what it comes down to.

Thanks again.

 

[NuSnake]

It comes down to luck man, the system isnt perfect, but its what you have to do to becaome an aviator, whether it be USMC or USN. The system is the same for everybody, that way they dont show favorites. If you want to be a military pilot(USN or USMC, not the Chair Force, muhahaha) you have to go through this, yeah it sucks but its the way it is, get over it and make a decision on the info thats avaliable.

Life sucks, then you die, so do the best you can with what you have.

 

[kmc9280]

If you are looking for a way to guarantee you a fighter slot, look into the Guard. You can get hired by a Guerd unit for a particular aircraft but it is very competitive- flt. hrs. etc. Also, units are different- some you need to be a resident of the state, some you need to already be in unit and some niether. Call a Guard unit or recruiter to get more info. Wouldn't be bad knowing you'll get that f-15 before you go to flight school.

Kevin

 

[Grandmaster235]

Good advice from kmc9280.

akoni78, I'm not trying to throw cold water on your plan or be a jackass, but your attitude isn't really ideal for this program. You're going to end up miserable. You need to look at the Air Guard or the USAF.

Grandmaster 235

 

[phrogdriver]

Join the Marines because you want to be a MARINE, not because your want to be a pilot.

Phrogs phorever

 

[Rainman]

All good advice. The ANG deal is pretty amazing if all you want is to fly fighters; definitely varies from state to state. If you're a resident of a state that needs some fresh pilots and have a boatload of hours and can bother some politicians it mayb happen for you. Like kmc said, very competitive and only applicable in some states. Others get all the need from previous military pilots, etc. One guy I knew of did the above and also enlisted first to start kissing the CO's ass. . .If that's you game and you want it that bad. . . .

Marines, AF, and Navy have almost the same jet percentage selection rates (right around 35%) out of "primary" (or UPT). They all have their needs and streaks.

From what I hear Marines are less subject to the streakiness of say the Navy's jet slots. High NSSs tend to get jets. When they need jet pilots, not as high NSSs get jets as well (last spring for example).

Everyone here is getting a sense about you and perhaps your motives (or perhaps judging based on 3 posts!). Keep in mind!!! The chances of getting into a F/A 18 3.5 years from now is very remote (9 months waiting/putting pkg together + 3 months OCS + 5 months waiting + 6 months TBS + 3 months waiting + 2 months API + 2 months waiting (lately) + 5 months primary + 3 months waiting (longer lately) + 13 months intermediate/advanced ------- of course that just gets you to the FRS)

If you don't make it (after OCS and accepting your commission) through flight school, your chances of getting a computer related job in the Corps is also small. We are designed to support infantry--bottom line. Marine Officers are around to lead Marines not write code!

Hope it helps.

 

[Lt_SNA_USMC]

Not to reiterate anything, but I do not know if you (Akoni) are green material if your sole goal is to get into a hornet. I went to OCS with guys like you who will be be broken-hearted at flight school when they get stuck in a helo. Me personally, I joined the Marine Corps to be with Marines. I think there are few things better than being with Marines, and almost nothing better than leading Marines. Not to say that flying an F-18 at mach 1.8 wouldn't be pretty motivating, but there is something about the thought of dropping a squad of Marines into a hot LZ, dodging rocks, and bottles, RPGs and god-know-what else that intrigues me as well. All Marine aviation is implemented in support of our Marine bretheren on the ground. Bottom line, join the Corps to be in the Corps. Not for any other reason. Then allow the Corps to place you where they think you will best serve.

Lt. Williamson

 

[akoni78]

I appreciate all of your feedback. I must say that through this forum I have gained worlds of knowledge about the process and the people. I must say the pride you guys/girls carry is one of a kind. If I do decide to go with the Corps, I will be yet another proud member.

However, I get hint that some of you don't think I am cut out for the Marines. I must again point out that I feel I was born to fly (not to say that CNATRA will feel the same way), so naturally my motivation would be in the air, yes, I would be a proud Marine Officer in the air, but it would still involve flying. Each "happy" Marine has some motivation or another (or why would they be there?). I'm sure the guy unwillingly shoveling Camel sh*t out of the desert trenches everyday has quite a different outlook than the F/A-18 pilot. No one is a puppet, so while we must, first and foremost, share the common pride and honor of belonging to the best branch the the United States Military, we must not completely discredit our individual goals and passions (for that is a large part of our drive as well).

Anyway, I spoke to a recruiter today to get some information and, after giving him all of my personal information, he told me that I have a pretty good chance of getting the "pilot" slot since I have a degree and since the "Mission" this year was very low (I am assuming the Mission is the number of PLC pilot slots?) . Does anyone else know about this?

Also,
-joshmountain, is there really that much waiting time in between schools?

-Would I have to attend regular boot camp before OCS?

-Can anyone tell me the difference between intermediate/advanced fligth school? and at what point would you know what you will be flying (i.e. - end of intermediate, end of advanced)?

Thanks again.