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Harvest Hawk C130 flown by Cobra and Jet guys??!?

Reconjoe

Reconjoe

Active Member
I'm not sure if this is just spotty reporting, distorted facts, or maybe just an awesome B tour billet come true, but anyone know anything about this?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=WNjbCslWOOw

At the end he states that Hornet and Cobra guys are used to pilot and man the weapon systems....if this is true it raises oh so many questions....like how pissed is the Herc community that someone else get's to come in and fly their clawed birds?
 
Treetop Flyer

Treetop Flyer

Well-Known Member
pilot
I know of a number of harrier guys who do harvest hawk. The C-130 pilots fly, and someone else operates the weapons in the back.
 
81montedriver

81montedriver

Well-Known Member
pilot
Not true. Our Harvest Hawk platforms are flown by our own Herc guys. The Fire Control Officers (FCO's) come from different communities. At least in my squadron, there is a Cobra and Harrier pilot as well as a Hornet backseater. Eventually, the plan is to have HH pilots cross trained as FCO's which has already started happening.

Not sure if FAC-A quals have anything to do with it although our 2 HH AC's are prior FACs. The copilots however are first tour pilots.

I just barely dodged the bullet of going on the HH. It is true that those guys are flying an ungodly amount of hours. However unlike those guys, I've done every mission the Herc can do. When it comes time for the CP's to upgrade to AC, I think they may be a step behind since all they do in the air is fly a fixed track and are unproficient in many mission sets if they have even done them.
 
P

phrogpilot73

Well-Known Member
Out of curiosity, is the KC-130J completely out of the DASC(A) business? Not so much IF you do it (I'm guessing not as of late), but if you CAN do it? I remember in OIF that Otis brought their UYQ-3As with them - only to find out that they didn't work in the J. Makes a great platform for AMC or DASC(A) because it's got ass ton of loiter time, and can be in the tanker track giving gas at the same time. Talk about multirole!!
 
K

KBayDog

Well-Known Member
Harrier Dude said:
The only thing more useless than a DASC is a DASC(A). That's where SA goes to die.
Click to expand...

But...but...DASC is the way we've always done it!

Looks like somebody needs another dose...

draft_lens10732461module97916351photo_1272490858green-kool-aid.jpg
 
81montedriver

81montedriver

Well-Known Member
pilot
phrogpilot73 said:
Out of curiosity, is the KC-130J completely out of the DASC(A) business? Not so much IF you do it (I'm guessing not as of late), but if you CAN do it? I remember in OIF that Otis brought their UYQ-3As with them - only to find out that they didn't work in the J. Makes a great platform for AMC or DASC(A) because it's got ass ton of loiter time, and can be in the tanker track giving gas at the same time. Talk about multirole!!
Click to expand...

Reserves with their T-models can. J's no.
 
usmarinemike

usmarinemike

Solidly part of the 42%.
pilot
Contributor
Good to see that the HH is getting work. Without knowing details, it seems like a rare example of a quick, successful acquisition. Using TacAir guys to fill FCO billets seems to make sense with the familiar sensors, weapons, and some of the TTPs probably being similar, at least until an FCO curriculum makes into the Herc T&R. Relative to some of the other places one can end up, it doesn't seem like such a bad IA.

WRT the DASC, there are some hard working Marines there that actually want shit to happen the right way. From what I've seen, neither the ACE nor the GCE have a good grasp on everything they do so they get cut out of the loop a lot at which point the rest of the users stop taking them seriously. I've been out of that game for awhile though so I can't speak to any recent history.
 
gaijin6423

gaijin6423

Ask me about ninjas!
Speaking as the unfortunate soul who actually had to plan/brief/plead all things DASC to 2d MEB prior to their introduction to Afghanistan, there aren't even many DASC Marines who understand WTF we were supposed to do. The, "That's the way we did it in Iraq," mentality was horrible. Add in a delegation of authority that was about as clear as shit water, and a few O-5s and O-6s who hated the living shit out of each other, and it was an eventful year+.

Which isn't to say that we didn't get anything worthwhile accomplished, of course. But the DASC had basically turned into a prized whipping boy that certain people just wanted to fight over who got to hit next, and the friendly neighborhood DASC OIC spent most of his time getting yelled at for doing what the ACE CO told him to do. The GCE, which had essentially no authority to clear any kind of appreciable fires on its own, thanks to the CAOC and power plays well beyond my pay grade, wasn't even a true GCE, as MEB kept a tight, tight control over who could do what. Still, we managed to--I'm convinced--help save a lot of good guys, and help a lot of bad guys turn into hamburger. One of the biggest problems I had was keeping my guys/gals in their lane, because they were so damn good and eager, that people tried to leverage that to get them to do shit that we had no business doing.

I could go on about Russian contract helo pilots, USAF generals getting into pissing contests with people on the radio, Afghan ANAAC birds, and the ACE-MEB 'Ark' debacle at Leatherneck, but no one wants to hear that shit.

But to expound on the original question about DASC(A), there is currently NO capability that I'm aware of. All the UYQ-3B's were due to be mothballed right around the time I got out, but that could have changed. As a DASC(A) SAD qual holder, it really does require a LOT more focus to maintain any kind of SA, but keep in mind that it was never designed to completely replicate the full functionality of a DASC. Add in that there was no inherent data capability to the system (ways around that), and no linear form of battlefield requiring the DASC to echelon, and you basically have a dinosaur. Not that it wouldn't have helped for certain events, mind you.
 
gaijin6423

gaijin6423

Ask me about ninjas!
Oh, and if you're looking for another perspective on how the MACG/DASC can better function on what amounts to a static battlefield, there was an article in the Gazette in...late 2009/early 2010 (I think) that explored just that. Before I exited stage right, my squadron XO and I were trying to get a couple 7208s/42s through EWTGLANT in an attempt to at least try a modern, distributed format for DASC ops. XO was pretty highly invested in the idea, and had just come from EWTGLANT, but it never gained any traction that I know of. Probably because our CO got fired right after I got out.
 
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