FO-Pilot Transition

[jacksonwt2g]

Does anyone know anything about transitioning from fo-pilot during api? I have heard that the top 10% of the api class can transition if they want to. Is that the only way? Is that top 10% of FOs in an api class or top 10% in general? (As I understand it, FOs and pilots are mixed in api classes) Is it all based on NSS score?

I am physically qualified, have 20/20 and I did pretty well on my astb (8/8) but my usna order of merit was hurting. Too much time spent in the bars or with my fiance' I guess. People just a few points ahead of me in OOM and several points lower astb got pilot and I didn't. I either tanked my interview (I didn't think I was that socially inept) or there are other sinister forces at work. They said astb was going to count 25% of overall score. Are there other factors considered? I don't know if rotc has a similar selection process but I'd love to hear from anyone who knows.

How is FO vs. pilot? Do I want to try to transition or should I be glad I got FO?

 

[wink]

In this highly competitive environment I'd be glad you got aviation at all. With the delays and overall distraction caused by the hurricanes, I don't think there will be any NFO-Pilot ransition at API. The program is not routine or a matter of policy. I don't know for sure last time they transitioned guys. It is only offered when a significant number of guys they were planning on being pilots don't make it to the VTs. Problems such as NPQ, DOR and even failure to ship to OCS sometimes leave the pilot pipeline short a few bodies. If they are fat on NFOs, then they will allow some guys to transition to pilot to fill the gap. Last I heard we were over manned in most every designator. Maybe someone here has more current info, but I wouldn't get your hopes up. Best part of being an NFO now is that you will get you wings a heck of a lot faster. NFO training should be less effected by hurricane damage. Sooner you get you wings sooner you have fun in the fleet and start on the payback commitment.

 

[jacksonwt2g]

How is the satisfaction with fo? I have heard good things, but only from a few people. My uncle (marine pilot way back in vietnam) insists that I would want to transfer, but I am not totally convinced. I haven't heard much about how the day-to-day job is. Some pilots ripping on the program, of course. No Future Outside. What is the word on FO training? Are we supposed to be up and running anytime soon? Sooner? We are all on a 30 day stop here. Supposed to have a meeting today about the details.

 

[usnmerritt]

I'm in this same boat too. I applied for pilot way back when, but couldn't get it because it was nearing the start of this over-saturation of pilots...seemingly obvious when you look back to right after 9/11 and the airlines started cutting. I've always wanted to switch over someday and am trying to prepare for the in-Fleet NFO-pilot transition, primarily because, like Wink said, the transition options in API are so slim. But, I'm trying to just enjoy the fact that I'm in aviation period and not dwell on my specific job. I'm sure I'll be able to switch someday, but who knows...I may not want to after serving a couple of tours with FO wings.

So, I'm with you on this one. I'm still a little uneasy about NFO, but getting more and more used to it everyday. I plan on knocking out API the best that I can and see if anything is available. But at the same time, because the Navy IS so saturated with pilots, their pipeline is so much more difficult to complete these days. I'm starting to like the idea of having all the training for NFO and knowing the back seat more and more everyday, because whenever I can apply for redesignation, it will make my package that much more impressive.

Anyway, I'm in this with you and hope to hear more advice on this thing as well. I guess as long as you keep the mindset that you'll enjoy whatever they give you, but you'll bend over backwards anyday for an open pilot slot, you'll be okay. Right now, with the way things are going in the world of aviation, I'm counting my blessings to even have been considered for a position here, let alone accepted. We'll still be in the plane horsing around with everyone else, just not 'driving' it quite as much.

Hope to hear more from you soon.

 

[SFgirl]

Does anyone know anything about transitioning from fo-pilot during api? I have heard that the top 10% of the api class can transition if they want to. Is that the only way? Is that top 10% of FOs in an api class or top 10% in general? (As I understand it, FOs and pilots are mixed in api classes) Is it all based on NSS score?

I am physically qualified, have 20/20 and I did pretty well on my astb (8/8) but my usna order of merit was hurting. Too much time spent in the bars or with my fiance' I guess. People just a few points ahead of me in OOM and several points lower astb got pilot and I didn't. I either tanked my interview (I didn't think I was that socially inept) or there are other sinister forces at work. They said astb was going to count 25% of overall score. Are there other factors considered? I don't know if rotc has a similar selection process but I'd love to hear from anyone who knows.

How is FO vs. pilot? Do I want to try to transition or should I be glad I got FO?

My question to all of you guys is that if you really want to fly, why not go over to the Marine side of things? WOuld they take FO-Pilot transitions after API? I heard they were hurting for pilots... but then I only know that they are taking pilots straight over...

 

[zab1001]

I have never ever heard this "top 10%" thing either, sounds like BS to me.

 

[Farva1]

Fact: Top guy in API class 0442 (completed API Sept 10, 2004), was a SNFO, but got transitioned to SNA. But keep in mind, he missed like 3 questions on all of the tests combined.............

 

[wink]

The perspective on NFO from a Vietnam era Marine pilot would not be too acurate, especially if he never flew with one. The current NFO program/career path is great. No difference between pilot and NFO career options and advancement. Only good natured ribbing in the fleet between the two. NFOs can give it back just as well as the monkeys behind the stick. In reality there is respect all around. As to the "No Future Outside" BS... it burns my back side. Where is the logic in that statement? So all the submariners, SWOs , Intel guys, USMC armor officers, etc have no jobs and are just standing in the unemployment lines??!! That statement is just like a narrow minded one demensional stick monkey. See Navy plane, drive Navy plane, see airliner, drive airliner. So I guess if the airlines aren't hiring or said pilot pokes his eye out and can't fly in the airlines he ends up in the same unemployment line with the thousands of NFOs and SWOs. As a former NFO you can do anything post Navy except be a pro pilot (there are exceptions, if you make the investment you can be a civ pro pilot like I did). If you can't imagine the civilian opportunities NFO training, years of operating high tech equipment, leadership and managment experience can get you then you may not be smart enough to be a NFO. Good luck. Pilot or NFO, Naval Aviation is a blast.

 

[usnmerritt]

Haha, that's the same load of stuff I heard once too! In fact, it was a ret. Capt. who worked for the financial offices in D.C. that told me to do everything I could to get out of the NFO position because of "No Future Outside." I can't jab at him too much because he's now my personal financial advisor, but it did stick with me ever since and created this feeling of uneasiness with the position. My first thought was, how could a guy who stared at books and tax bills all day long know the first thing about the experience of an NFO?

Although, I will admit, his statements have still stuck with me this entire time. I still wonder about the command potential and experience factor in the NFO field, all because of what he said. But, I am well aware of the joys of the job and have no regret as to choosing it. It just stays in the back of my mind and if a pilot slot ever opens up, I'll launch at it with full force, but still knowing that I will love whatever they give me.

So, I understand how those statements can piss you off. It pissed me off and made, as I'm sure, many others questions their decisions for NFO positions throughout their own careers. Needless statements like those need to stay in the mouths of those who have obviously never experienced the joys of either NA or NFO!

 

[cindy]

Unless things have changed, the top 10% of API get their choice SNFO/SNA if otherwise qualified. Closely held secret. The guy you want to see is Charlie Noble. Hard to get ahold of but well worth it. Ask around.

 

[jacksonwt2g]

In no way did I mean to suggest that I am not peeing my pants in excitement at the opportunity to be a FO. I am just trying to gain some perspective. It is difficult because every time I go to a brief for all future SNAs and SNFOs here at usna, they talk to us like we are all going pilot and kind of skip all the details pertaining to NFOs. As a result, I'm left a little uninformed about my future profession. The top 10% thing was briefed to us as a current (at the time) policy that could be modified or revoked at will. They emphasized that it was by no means a guarenteed door to transition through. I have no idea what effect Ivan has had on the whole thing. I haven't heard much about what the chances are of transitioning post-api but would love to hear if anybody knows about it. I also have not heard about transfering to usmc pilot. I am really excited about every possible rout I can take, and will commit myself whole-heartedly to whatever I end up doing. I just don't want to go in blind.

 

[wink]

NFOs cammand at the same rate as pilots SWOs and submariners. Squadron command rotates from pilot to NFO. All NFO VTs are commanded by NFOs. I know guys that were are NFOs that have been the Air Boss, CVN Skipper, Wing Commander etc. Navy career wise you should not ever worry about your opportunities as an NFO. This is the Navy. Top jobs are spread among UNRESTRICTED LINE OFFICERS. The CV Battlegroup can be commanded by a Submariner. NTC Great Lakes (boot camp) commanded by a NFO. Makes no matter.

 

[usnmerritt]

Squanto2,

Here is the link for the NFO-Pilot program. It has all the criteria for selection and requirements needed to be fulfilled before applying.

http://www.persnet.navy.mil/pers43/Aviation_Boards/NFO_to_Pilot_Program/nfotopilot_home.htm

Also, its off of the main Aviation Officer Distribution website that contains all the information that you'd probably like to know about the specifics with each career path.

http://www.persnet.navy.mil/pers43/index.html

Wink,

Thanks for that info. That's what I always thought about nearly every field in the Navy, but you know it only takes one misguided comment to make you think otherwise. I'm very excited to hopefully become a winged NFO someday and look forward to every minute it takes to get there. And, if I get the opportunity to expand my horizons and go for pilot, I definitely will. Either way, you put us in the air...we're happy! But thanks for the much-need info about what really happens out there. I must say that I've been waiting for that for quite some time now. Thanks again!

 

[jacksonwt2g]

Thanks for the links, Usnmerrit, I think I am good on everything I just hope I make the age limit! I'm already 27, who knows how long the pipeline will take now. Are you currently in API?

 

[jacksonwt2g]

SFGirlfriend- What is the story with transitioning over to usmc pilot? I'm not totally opposed to the idea of going marine (though my father would probably roll over in his grave)...the only detractor besides buying about $10k in uniforms is all those damn marines I'd have to work with. Is that really an option or does the Navy already have it's claws in me now that I am commissioned?