First MH-60R squadron is established!

[phrogdriver]

The thing about naval (Marine and Navy) helos is there aren't as many of us to start with, and when we do deploy, it's in smaller units. The small units are expected to be really for the full set of missions. Plus, you're out in the middle of the ocean, so it's not as if they're sending anyone else to help you out!

 

[MasterBates]

60B is (some current guy correct me)
839 TGT limits without C-Power
891 with C-power. C-power shuts off ECS.

Have to throw the switch (on the collective head) to get it.

 

[bobbybrock]

The L model is a truck. I've been at 8000 MSL 99 degrees and 20300lbs ( level flight) and lost an engine and it was no problem. If this was an A model I would have been in a shit sandwich.
The Mike model will have even more power plus the CAAS cockpit.

 

[gregsivers]

60B is (some current guy correct me)
839 TGT limits without C-Power
891 with C-power. C-power shuts off ECS.

Have to throw the switch (on the collective head) to get it.

No correction needed, some stuff you just can't dump.

 

[kejo]

No correction needed, some stuff you just can't dump.

Two months and some change into the ATO phase, and I say some stuff you most certainly will dump...

 

[Gatordev]

Two months and some change into the ATO phase, and I say some stuff you most certainly will dump...

It comes back though. It took me about a month into relearning the T-34 before I stopped wanting to say "...aft and shear-wired..." when starting the checklist.

 

[hawkmech]

It bums me out that this mentality formed well after I got out of the Navy. Shooting guns from a helo was one of the reasons I joined the Army Reserve (along with getting to fly again).

I hear that. I'm in the Army Guard right now, but when I heard about the HSC/HSM concept, and what it's about, I couldn't wait to get back in the Navy. I had a feeling the Navy might change the mission and capabilities of its helo squadrons to be more "relevant" in the GWOT (not too many subs in AQ's inventory), but when I read about them, I knew I couldn't stay in the minor leagues.

 

[bobbybrock]

I hear that. I'm in the Army Guard right now, but when I heard about the HSC/HSM concept, and what it's about, I couldn't wait to get back in the Navy. I had a feeling the Navy might change the mission and capabilities of its helo squadrons to be more "relevant" in the GWOT (not too many subs in AQ'a inventory), but when I read about them, I knew I couldn't stay in the minor leagues.

When I was active duty I used to think the "Guard"was bush league as well.
As a guardsman I've seen more experience then any of my time on active duty. When you have senior pilots with over 10000 hours it is hard to call the guard the minors. I'm sure there are quite a few guard pilots with time downtown who would also disgree with you.
You can put all the bells and whistles you want on an aircraft, but if you don't get to go to the sandbox it's still just a scrimmage.

 

[phrogpilot73]

When I was active duty I used to think the "Guard"was bush league as well.
As a guardsman I've seen more experience then any of my time on active duty. When you have senior pilots with over 10000 hours it is hard to call the guard the minors. I'm sure there are quite a few guard pilots with time downtown who would also disgree with you.
You can put all the bells and whistles you want on an aircraft, but if you don't get to go to the sandbox it's still just a scrimmage.

So I guess I'm a starting all-american pilot, but a High School JV FAC...

 

[HeloBubba]

Not to insult bobbybrock, but I think hawkmech was equating Army Aviation as a whole to the minor leagues and Naval Aviation as the big leagues.

You are correct bobbybrock about the amount of collective flight time stashed in the Guard. I flew with Viet Nam era pilots, not a whole lot fazed them in the air (unless it was an especially odorous flatulence issued while the doors and windows were closed ).

 

[hawkmech]

Not to insult bobbybrock, but I think hawkmech was equating Army Aviation as a whole to the minor leagues and Naval Aviation as the big leagues.

Exactly. I wouldn't want to detract from the Guard pilots, a lot of them are top-notch, and we all know the Guard puts its work in. They're just in an inferior system.

I guess what I'm saying is that I like the way the Navy's jacked up better than the way the Army's jacked up.:icon_tong

 

[bobbybrock]

Not to insult bobbybrock, but I think hawkmech was equating Army Aviation as a whole to the minor leagues and Naval Aviation as the big leagues.

I'll be the first to concede that Army Aviation has it's problems. As far a branch it has to many to count. But the helo pilots it produces are the most experienced of any branch. You'd be hard pressed to find an Army pilot these days without combat time. Some bagging up to 1300 combat hours a year. There are many misconceptions as to what we do. I've even been asked by Navy and Air Forces bubbas why we don't fly instruments. Again ,another misconception. We fly plenty of IMC missions.
The reason Army aviations works is because of these experienced aviators getting the job done despite poor leadership.

 

[HeloBubba]

I'll be the first to concede that Army Aviation has it's problems. As far a branch it has to many to count. But the helo pilots it produces are the most experienced of any branch. You'd be hard pressed to find an Army pilot these days without combat time. Some bagging up to 1300 combat hours a year. There are many misconceptions as to what we do. I've even been asked by Navy and Air Forces bubbas why we don't fly instruments. Again ,another misconception. We fly plenty of IMC missions.
The reason Army aviations works is because of these experienced aviators getting the job done despite poor leadership.

Having flown both in both Naval and Army Aviation (500+ in the Navy, less in the Army), I agree with everything you are saying about the Army. I believe it is the fruit of their Warrant Officer program. They wanted helicopter pilots to be specialists and that's what they are in the extreme. I will also confirm your statement about Army Aviation leadership, it tends to be poor and IMO that stems from the higher-ups not "getting" aviation as a whole.

And yes, the Army does fly IMC. I've seen my share of flying the needles so we could RTB in the goo. Friggin' upstate NY, CAVU one minute, 300, 1/2 mile the next.

 

[HeloBubba]

I guess what I'm saying is that I like the way the Navy's jacked up better than the way the Army's jacked up.:icon_tong

Same here. Things the Army did that I never liked:

- Flying over water without a personal flotation device.
- Flying over water, or way out in BFE in a single engine aircraft.
- What's a FOD walkdown?

For each one of those there were some things they did that the Navy would NEVER do in my day.

 

[bobbybrock]

Same here. Things the Army did that I never liked:

- Flying over water without a personal flotation device.
- Flying over water, or way out in BFE in a single engine aircraft.
- What's a FOD walkdown?

For each one of those there were some things they did that the Navy would NEVER do in my day.

As a Standards Officer I fly dual and single engine aircraft for the guard. If what you are saying is true than it goes totally against army regs. Overwater flight requires some type of LPU, sinlge and dual engine aircraft. That is a leadership issue. As far as the FOD walks, same applies. The command should have a program in place. There in lies the big difference between Navy and Army Air. The skipper of that Navy unit knows what looks wrong. The Army commander usually doesn't.