Female soldiers eyed for combat

[VarmintShooter]

It all comes down to money. Reservists are cheaper than active duty by virtue that we do not get retirement until age 60. For every dollar that the Pentagon spends on active duty pay, it spends another 84 cents for retirement pay. If you delay retirement by on average 20 years, you save a lot of coin.

Holy sh!t ... I feel stupid for not figuring that out.

Seems like they should change the name from "Reserves" to something else though if the plan is to keep them on extended active duty. I guess it's ok if you guys know what you are signing up for (ie. how the Navy intends to utilize you), although to me I don't think it would be worth it.

Glad I'm on active duty ...

 

[Clux4]

We have to worry about landmines, chow, medical and now the logistic officer has to make sure that there is proper arrangement that the only female in the platoon can get adequate hygiene. This is something less we have to worry about and I am not dogging the women for this, because that is how they are made otherwise I would be asking the creator what he was doing.
How many women can honestly look at a child in the face and pull a trigger, knowing fully well that this child might have a grenade in the pocket meant to kill you. What is so fun about pulling a trigger or playing in the mud that a woman will really be excited about doing? Most of the men out there do not even want to be there. Going months without a clean shave and proper shower must be really exciting!!
Why don’t the women take the roles of the men in non-combatant roles and let the men go to the hot spots? It is funny that the liberals are pushing for this integration crap because when the same liberal media starts showing pictures of raped women in combat, the same liberal would be the ones to shout out because they cannot stomach it.
Apart from the distraction that women will be to men who have not seen their wives and girlfriends in months, we will now have a case load of rape, equality, sexual harassment incidents in combatant units; something less to worry about ones again.
I know there are women stronger than me. I will be one of the first people to admit that I am weak, but this will not work. I wonder why we do not have a woman playing football for the Dallas Cowboys? Maybe we should try some integration in the civilian world before using the military as a guinea pig?
If your ambition has always being to kill Charlie as a female, good luck I guess the realization of your dream will come to effect in the nearest future but I hope you will not be one of the few victims of a political blunder.

 

[EngineGirl]

Apart from the distraction that women will be to men who have not seen their wives and girlfriends in months, we will now have a case load of rape, equality, sexual harassment incidents in combatant units; something less to worry about ones again.

Wow....this part of the your statement really p*sses me off. First, you say that women will be a "distraction" to men. What, are men animals that can't control their urges? Second, saying that there will be a "case load" of rape, sexual harrassment, etc., and that is something that would have to be worried about is messed up. This isn't the females fault. Men should never, ever do this to a female. Saying that putting women in combatant units will cause this is blaming the women for what happens to them. This is a horrible excuse for not having women in the units and anyone who would say that it is a womens fault for being assulted is a pathetic excuse for a human.

EngineGirl

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Why don’t the women take the roles of the men in non-combatant roles and let the men go to the hot spots?

Yeah, great idea. Sorta like in WWII and then when the War was over all the men came back and the women lost there jobs.....

 

[rare21]

Second, saying that there will be a "case load" of rape, sexual harrassment, etc., and that is something that would have to be worried about is messed up. This isn't the females fault. Men should never, ever do this to a female. .....

Unfortunately all that WILL happen. Look at the news Men unfortunately do do that to females. Good book on this subject: "The Kinder Gentler Military."

 

[EngineGirl]

Unfortunately all that WILL happen. Look at the news Men unfortunately do do that to females. Good book on this subject: "The Kinder Gentler Military."

Trust me, I'm one of the last people that thiss need to told that this happens. I'm just saying that Clux using it is a horrible excuse to use to keep women out of certain areas. It's saying that because some men do horrible things that we should close the door to women. It's not the womens, fault, its the mens. I mean, they could've used the same excuse when women wanted to get into universitys, go into "mens" fields, join the military at all, etc. To protect the women from the "bad men", we must keep the women out...not a good reason (other reasons are good reasons, but this one isn't).

EngineGirl

 

[Clux4]

Wow....this part of the your statement really p*sses me off. First, you say that women will be a "distraction" to men. What, are men animals that can't control their urges? Second, saying that there will be a "case load" of rape, sexual harrassment, etc., and that is something that would have to be worried about is messed up. This isn't the females fault. Men should never, ever do this to a female. Saying that putting women in combatant units will cause this is blaming the women for what happens to them. This is a horrible excuse for not having women in the units and anyone who would say that it is a womens fault for being assulted is a pathetic excuse for a human.

I am not blaming women for the men that cannot hold the snake in their pants, but this is just part of being human. The Airforce Academy scandal is an example of what might happen. Looking at this same issue from a woman's point of view, they are also in the same shoes as the men. I know how I felt after 3 months of bootcamp!
Seriously women are not in combat roles yet and there are many incidents of sexual harassment that are not reported how much more when you throw them in units with men. I just feel for the women, not that their work on the ground will affect me from performing mine. I will be glad to drop the bombs when they call me or pick them up when they need my services.
I am not bringing women down by any means but this is something else to think about.

 

[EngineGirl]

I am not blaming women for the men that cannot hold the snake in their pants, but this is just part of being human. .

Ummmmm....no, that is not part of being a human. That is a sick individual who needs not to be in the military and who needs serious help.

Seriously women are not in combat roles yet and there are many incidents of sexual harassment that are not reported how much more when you throw them in units with men.

Well maybe its under reported because 1) women are often made to feel like its their fault it happened and some men actually beleive that 2) some people say "well, women shouldn't be in the military anyways" 3) people make excuses for the men, saying that they can't help it becasue the have "urges" or what not and 4) as soon as a women says she was harrased, everything she has every done is looked at under a mircoscope and disected.

 

[VetteMuscle427]

Simma down now, simma down.... everyone take a DEEEEEP breath... we're all friends here right?

 

[VarmintShooter]

What about when it is consensual on both sides? Happens all the time on the boat (just look at how many end up going to mast for hooking up on deployment). It's not the woman's fault. It's not the man's fault. It's just what happens when you put a bunch of people together in a confined area for a long period of time. Unfortunately it does hurt discipline and unit cohesion (how many of you wish to work in close quarters with your exes?).

So if you agree with all of this, the question becomes: is being politically correct (or advancing women's lib, or whatever) worth the obvious issues that it already causes in non-combatant units?

Instaed of assigning blame for what happens, look at the impact that it has and evaluate the gain versus the cost.

 

[Clux4]

What about when it is consensual on both sides? Happens all the time on the boat (just look at how many end up going to mast for hooking up on deployment). It's not the woman's fault. It's not the man's fault. It's just what happens when you put a bunch of people together in a confined area for a long period of time. Unfortunately it does hurt discipline and unit cohesion (how many of you wish to work in close quarters with your exes?).

So if you agree with all of this, the question becomes: is being politically correct (or advancing women's lib, or whatever) worth the obvious issues that it already causes in non-combatant units?

Instaed of assigning blame for what happens, look at the impact that it has and evaluate the gain versus the cost.

I guess this is what i have been trying to say but could not get it out ! Fraternity is the big one the Corps does not take for granted and I can see people falling victim of this.

 

[kevin]

"I know there are women stronger than me. I will be one of the first people to admit that I am weak, but this will not work. I wonder why we do not have a woman playing football for the Dallas Cowboys? Maybe we should try some integration in the civilian world before using the military as a guinea pig?"

--i understand the point you're making, but it's a bad argument. professional sports represents the elite few of MALES, let alone the entire population (well, except for baseball players---uh oh).

"How many women can honestly look at a child in the face and pull a trigger, knowing fully well that this child might have a grenade in the pocket meant to kill you."

--i dont know, man....ive met some pretty cold-hearted women before. not to mention that i personally would struggle with this as well...it's not just women who generally wouldnt enjoy shooting a kid. matter of fact- i remember seeing a special on a green beret unit in iraq that was discovered and almost killed because the head member didnt want to shoot 2 kids.

i think the rape, sexual harrassment, etc issues are valid arguments...but i still dont believe that's grounds enough for restricting capable women from pursuing a dream. that's like saying to a 1st grader "you can't sit in the lunch room cause the 2nd graders might beat you up". it's something that should be dealt with when it happens, and aside from that, a women should have the option of deciding whether to put herself in that kind of environment or not.

"So if you agree with all of this, the question becomes: is being politically correct (or advancing women's lib, or whatever) worth the obvious issues that it already causes in non-combatant units?"

--i dont think this is quite a women's lib argument. women's lib would be something like saying "34% of people entering infantry units this year have to be female". I don't think anyone is arguing for affirmative action....i for one am just saying if a girl can hack it out with the guys and wants to do it, it should be gender-blind.

the medical issues are a totally seperate area, however, that is a problem. can't say i've got a good solution for that. all i know is i never had any hope of becoming a military pilot until enough good doctors got together and created laser-surgery....

 

[manny7_99]

just a thought

Wow....this part of the your statement really p*sses me off. First, you say that women will be a "distraction" to men. What, are men animals that can't control their urges? Second, saying that there will be a "case load" of rape, sexual harrassment, etc., and that is something that would have to be worried about is messed up. This isn't the females fault. Men should never, ever do this to a female. Saying that putting women in combatant units will cause this is blaming the women for what happens to them. This is a horrible excuse for not having women in the units and anyone who would say that it is a womens fault for being assulted is a pathetic excuse for a human.

EngineGirl

edit

You are really gonna hate me for this post. That is the sad truth...sometimes men cant control themselves, especially if they havent seen "action" for a while. Testosterone build ups are not a pretty thing. Sadly but truly, it would decrease performance and endanger women in combat units.

yes it is the mens fault, yes it should not happen, yes men are "sick", but at the end of the day...those "sick" men are the ones getting the job done on the ground. It is not about fairness, it is about who can do the best job. A woman would only be a distraction, and that is considering she is actually able to perform on the same level. It is human nature and there is nothing we can do about it, it is not a perfect world.

like I said, you'll probably hate me for this post but it's just the truth. If I am not mistaken you did mention once that some of the men you worked with had an issue "staring." Why bring those issues to the field? If you have ever been around an infantry unit, you would know what I am talking about. It may be unfair and all you want it, then again, aren't you being too emotional? guys will always be guys, and girls alway girls regardless of how "progressive" your thinking may be.

and by the way...this is not about who's dreams, this is about the mission. Too much GI Jane for whoever said that.

S/F

 

[VarmintShooter]

--i dont think this is quite a women's lib argument. women's lib would be something like saying "34% of people entering infantry units this year have to be female". I don't think anyone is arguing for affirmative action....i for one am just saying if a girl can hack it out with the guys and wants to do it, it should be gender-blind.

Oh, semantics

So it's not women's lib then. My point still stands ... it is your opinion that "if a girl can hack it out with the guys and wants to do it," her wants should be placed above the obvious issues that it causes within the service. So mission accomplishment is a secondary goal here?

 

[Flash]

Israel initially had women infantry, then removed them and now I believe has women in infantry units.

I believe Israel has let women in their combat arms units only in time of national emergency, they need everyone they can use. I am pretty sure they are not in combat arms tight now. They do fly fighter jets though.

 

[kevin]

"her wants should be placed above the obvious issues that it causes within the service."

--those obvious issues are issues now...that doesn't mean they can't be worked out (my initial point). there was an issue regarding women in aircraft when that started too...what's your point?

"So mission accomplishment is a secondary goal here?"

--where's the definitive proof it's going to compromise mission accomplishment? besides your opinions, i dont see much.

semantics are important here. believe it or not, im fed up with a lot of the women's lib movement stuff too (ie, see my 1,110 posts on abortion), but to lump everything together into the negative connotation "women's lib" is generalizing. just like anything else, it's got its bad and good. a lot of great things have come out of it, and more can as well.