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Fallon SAR bird goes down, all crewmembers rescued

Jim123

DD-214 in hand and I'm gonna party like it's 1998
pilot
It’s interesting that the USAF has an enlisted rate specifically tailored to providing survival training. Pretty stout syllabus too, if I recall.
I think it's an NEC that Navy parachute riggers, er, Aircrew Survival Equipmentmen, typically get. Sorta the same but different way of organizing specialties. YNs who work in the uber secret world tell me they used to be cryptologists—CTA—until BUPERS got rid of A branch and folded them into the YN rating. (I doubt I'm telling you anything you didn't already know, it's more like discussion for the group.) But I do wonder if we're missing out on anything in the Navy by not making it its own dedicated rate.
 

Griz882

Livin' On the Right Side of the River From Pags!
pilot
Contributor
So, given the tangential subject line, I'll post this here. Was up at Eielson AFB, AK last week. My nephew in law took command of the Arctic Survival School there. Was fun. Got an intro to how they do business, see the facilities and training areas and meet the crew. Good bunch of guys. Very sharp. So in the classroom displays I see this raft. They tell me it is standard pack for all the USAF ejection seats. Very sweet. Inflated insulated floor and as you can see, inflated side curtains that can be closed around the survivor. Does the Navy use this now? The old raft we used back in the 20th century had what seemed like just an 8 mil rubber floor and flappy things you pulled over the raft. This is far superior.
View attachment 31679
Does this go over, or under, the break-down combat rifle?
 

cfam

A pilot is a pilot. An NFO is something else.
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
So, given the tangential subject line, I'll post this here. Was up at Eielson AFB, AK last week. My nephew in law took command of the Arctic Survival School there. Was fun. Got an intro to how they do business, see the facilities and training areas and meet the crew. Good bunch of guys. Very sharp. So in the classroom displays I see this raft. They tell me it is standard pack for all the USAF ejection seats. Very sweet. Inflated insulated floor and as you can see, inflated side curtains that can be closed around the survivor. Does the Navy use this now? The old raft we used back in the 20th century had what seemed like just an 8 mil rubber floor and flappy things you pulled over the raft. This is far superior.
View attachment 31679
I just did water survival a few months ago, and that looks pretty similar to what we practiced with in the pool.
 

wink

OLD VS NFO.
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
I think it's an NEC that Navy parachute riggers, er, Aircrew Survival Equipmentmen, typically get. Sorta the same but different way of organizing specialties. YNs who work in the uber secret world tell me they used to be cryptologists—CTA—until BUPERS got rid of A branch and folded them into the YN rating. (I doubt I'm telling you anything you didn't already know, it's more like discussion for the group.) But I do wonder if we're missing out on anything in the Navy by not making it its own dedicated rate.
You are right, well back in my day anyway. As an Ensign I had the AME/PR shop and it was a gig some of the guys coveted. Still, our guys are part time amatuers compared to the guys I met with a SERE mos. The amount of military training they have is interesting. Almost all went to Army Airborne, some to specialty infantry courses like land nav and pathfinding or the Army's mountain warfare school. To me it was stereotypical AF, more money than they knew what to do with. In the summer they go to specialty courses, PCS, perform in house continuing ed, and train the new instructors. For the last couple years that includes a caribou hunt in September. Outfitter/guide offers his services for free if they piggy back on one of his scheduled hunts. The AF dudes set up their own shelters and eat their own food, evaluate new equipment and the guide puts them on Caribou. The video loop on the TV in their ready room looks like a hunting and fishing travelogue. Bear, moose, caribou, goat, wolf, badger, wolverine, salmon, pike, grayling, and more. Awesome gig if you are an outdoorsman and can hack the winter.
 

Pags

Positive Void Coefficient
pilot
You are right, well back in my day anyway. As an Ensign I had the AME/PR shop and it was a gig some of the guys coveted. Still, our guys are part time amatuers compared to the guys I met with a SERE mos. The amount of military training they have is interesting. Almost all went to Army Airborne, some to specialty infantry courses like land nav and pathfinding or the Army's mountain warfare school. To me it was stereotypical AF, more money than they knew what to do with. In the summer they go to specialty courses, PCS, perform in house continuing ed, and train the new instructors. For the last couple years that includes a caribou hunt in September. Outfitter/guide offers his services for free if they piggy back on one of his scheduled hunts. The AF dudes set up their own shelters and eat their own food, evaluate new equipment and the guide puts them on Caribou. The video loop on the TV in their ready room looks like a hunting and fishing travelogue. Bear, moose, caribou, goat, wolf, badger, wolverine, salmon, pike, grayling, and more. Awesome gig if you are an outdoorsman and can hack the winter.
I think the USN SERE dudes spend their time similarly when they aren't rolling up wayward Yankee air pirates.
 

Jim123

DD-214 in hand and I'm gonna party like it's 1998
pilot
I just did water survival a few months ago, and that looks pretty similar to what we practiced with in the pool.
I might be remembering it wrong then.

For some reason I didn't think we climbed into the full on kind that you zip up and around you, but then again maybe I'm all mixed up and that's the only kind of single place raft. (Makes a good sunshade in any climate too.)
 

Treetop Flyer

Well-Known Member
pilot
So, given the tangential subject line, I'll post this here. Was up at Eielson AFB, AK last week. My nephew in law took command of the Arctic Survival School there. Was fun. Got an intro to how they do business, see the facilities and training areas and meet the crew. Good bunch of guys. Very sharp. So in the classroom displays I see this raft. They tell me it is standard pack for all the USAF ejection seats. Very sweet. Inflated insulated floor and as you can see, inflated side curtains that can be closed around the survivor. Does the Navy use this now? The old raft we used back in the 20th century had what seemed like just an 8 mil rubber floor and flappy things you pulled over the raft. This is far superior.
View attachment 31679
Looks better than the “shark taco” raft the TAV-8B had. It was like two pool cushions sewn together to help you “float” partially submerged in a raft taco.
 

nittany03

FUBIJAR
pilot
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
USAF has a break down over under survival shot gun? .... Oh, never mind.
It's a break-down short barrel AR, and for everyone who'd scoff at it, didn't it get fast-tracked after the Jordanian Viper driver got broiled alive on YouTube? I'd rather have a few mags of 5.56 between me and that fate than a dinky M11.
 

wink

OLD VS NFO.
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
I think the USN SERE dudes spend their time similarly when they aren't rolling up wayward Yankee air pirates.
What, hunting or serious military training? I never saw a Navy SERE instructor with Helicopter Air Assault, Dive master, or Pathfinder devices. I simply do not believe there is money or interest by Big Navy in that kind of training for a PR who will serve in the billet once in a career. AF dudes spend a career instructing SERE and survival. We don't even have fulltime career water survival instructors.
 

RedFive

Well-Known Member
pilot
None
Contributor
It’s interesting that the USAF has an enlisted rate specifically tailored to providing survival training. Pretty stout syllabus too, if I recall.
As far as I can tell from my interactions with them, these guys do SERE as their full time gig. Each base has its own SERE Instructors who provide recurrent training to aircrews in addition to the initial AF SERE up in Fairchild. I forget how often it is we have to go, but I believe it's every three or four years. I don't recommend getting scheduled for the January class at Travis, you'll find yourself jumping in the San Francisco bay to play with the life raft. You won't need coffee that morning!

No desire to quarterback the accident and I'm really glad these guys are okay, but do the Station SAR guys have some type of waiver to go above 10k? Or did the limit change in NATOPS? Purely curious.
 
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