Except for that whole 29 Palms thing.
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FAC Tour: The good and the bad
- Thread starter 81montedriver
- Start date
Except for that whole 29 Palms thing.
So shortly after my first post, my name came up on the FY14 off cycle movers list. Other than 2nd ANGLICO, the list of available billets for FW Company Grade (only 12 total available) sucked so I volunteered for a FAC Tour through the MAG. The monitor ok'd it so looks like its a go for the moment.
I'd go to TACP school in Jan, check in to 2/9 in Mar, westpac udp from Aug 14- Feb 15 and checkout Mar 15. Sounds like a decent enough deal. Thanks again for sharing your experiences, and if there are any other prior FACs I'd like to hear your experience as well.
I'd go to TACP school in Jan, check in to 2/9 in Mar, westpac udp from Aug 14- Feb 15 and checkout Mar 15. Sounds like a decent enough deal. Thanks again for sharing your experiences, and if there are any other prior FACs I'd like to hear your experience as well.
I am pretty sure I worked for you on multiple occasions in Sangin. DEALER.
Almost certainly. There was plenty of work to be had there.
/Driftwood 20 (Sep 10-Apr 11)
Some of us use to call it "Bangin in Sangin" whenever we got a JTAR up there (daily). "What are you guys doing today? Oh got one down in Marjah then we are bangin in Sangin." And yes I do remember working for Driftwood 20.
Agreed. I'm 5 months into mine and just started deployment. I'll have more to post when I get back since mine is a UDP deployment and I'll have tons of stories of controlling aircraft... I mean planning exercises.
Are you coming out from 3rd Marines? If so your FAC's that are here now are good dudes. Hit me up when you get on island, we can pass you all the gouge we've figured out thus far.
A bottle of Andre can be surprisingly expensive in Japan.
So I just finished up my FAC tour and wanted to provide some fresh insight as to my experience. I will also say that all the prior FACS who responded previously were spot on and there were only minor differences to my experience as a whole.
1. Mine was with a battalion so it was 12 months total with a 6 month deployment.
2. Unpredictable but busy. I checked in post ITX but there was still a bunch of shit left to do. We had a couple of events out in the field as well as a number of taskers and training objectives to complete prior to predeployment leave. I was usually at work from 0800 - 1500.
3. Like the other guys said, there are just as many fat bodies in the infantry as in the wing. Everyone seems to find a way to make it work. There were very few occasions where I actually had to put my physical ability to use. So bottom line is, whether you run a 300 or 225, nobody is really going to care or notice.
4. Not in the battalion. Most of the time when I did CAS, Iworked in a FiST team. There are enlisted Marines in the team but you are not reponsible for their evaluations. Although you are there to help them. More specifically I'm talking about the 0861 Arty Scouts who usually are qualified JFO's waiting for their turn for TACP school. You should be there to help them get more comfortable with air stuff. Whenever I had air on station, I took enough controls to make myself current and the rest went to the JFO's. I only do this for a year but they will continue to do it for years afterwords so it made sense to give them the bulk of the reps.
5. Absolutely yes. When I asked for the FAC tour, right off the bat, the PSD XO and monitor asked me what I wanted I wanted on the backside. A month after checking into 2/9 (11 months until FAC tour complete) I had orders to a Herk squadron. If you left your community with a good rep, they I'll fight to get you back and the monitor has just as good a reason to send you back.
6. Mine was a UDP to Okinawa. My previous deployments were MEU's so UDP is similar and different. Similar in the sense that optempo is busy with exercises as well as the potential to conduct real world operations. We conducted 6 different exercises over 6 months as well as stood alert for 2 months as all UDP battalions do. Different in the fact that you work a garrison schedule. You work M-F 0730-1630 and have weekends off. Us FACS became the action officers for all exercises so planning for 2 exercises each kept us very busy at first. However we had air involved in most of the exercises so we each got our fair share of controls.
Bottom line it was a great tour. I don't think I'm ready to say it was my best but it was definitely good. I learned a ton about the bigger picture of the Marine Corps and have a newfound respect for the ground side. I learned that the ground side does many this well as well as many things poorly. I learned that the air side, as much shit as it receives, works way more hours. I learned the difference between supported and supporting. I learned that there are a ton of guys who still are around that captured Camp Rhino in 2001 as well as the initial invasion into Iraq in 2003. Listening to them talk about their experiences was one of the more humbling experiences of my career. The fact that they are still around to deploy, fight and teach the junior Marines is incredible in my opinion.
I'll list some pros and cons as save rounds:
Pros:
- schedule. Your boss is the OPSO but most of the time you could get away with a very lax schedule.
- you're a Captain in an infantry battalion. I know somebody already mentioned this that is a powerful position in an infantry battalion. Officers will literally call you sir right up until they get promoted to captain. You have all the perks of a company commander withouth the responsibility.
-see a different side of the Marine Corps and learn all you can.
- you will see way more leadership amongst the NCO ranks compared to the wing. A corporal is the shit. A Sgt is a fuckin god. Those guys can legitimately make or break a platoon.
- going to the field is nothing like it was at TBS. I always had my own tent, woke up when I wanted and smoked cigars regularly. If I didn't want to bring a weapon, I didn't bring one.
- we all grew mustaches out of regs and nobody including the Battalion Commander cared because we were pilots.
Cons:
-crew rest does not exist.
- hotel rooms and the chow hall do not exist in the field. Get used to living in a tent and eating MRE's. If it's cold and rainy, you still go to the field.
-you don't fly.
- writing orders.
-writing LOI's for everything.
-useless mundane meetings
- nobody tells the air shop shit. I usually found out about formations and meetings after they happened.
I will also mention that I was a company FAC. I supported 2 of our companies and in my battalion it was way better an being the AirO. I supported my companies and that's it. Our AirO got to deal with most BS meetings and other various extra duties while I was in the field controlling air. However every battalion is different so don't take my experience to heart.
Good luck to any future FACS.
81montedriver had a bunch of good input, and I agree with a lot of it. For the sake of providing the opposite side of the spectrum I figured I would add a few comments.
I am 10 months into my 18 month FAC tour with an infantry battalion. Originally it was supposed to be a 12 month tour, however the unit's deployment slid but my report date didn't. I think some of the differences between my experience and those who loved their tours might be because of the east coast vs west coast culture. You WILL stay on your current coast unless you fill a FAC billet through the monitor (recon/ anglico/ marsoc).
If I had to do it over again, I would not have volunteered for a FAC tour, at least not with a normal battalion. I would have tried to get orders to Recon or ANGLICO. You come out of TACP school the same, but the JTACs at those places get better equipment, more funding, and better training. Also, in my experience there is less of a parade ground mentality in those units. The drawback is that usually the orders are 24 months, but I'll be close to that anyways. One of the biggest drawbacks is when you get back from your FAC deployment you will go right back to a squadron that's about to deploy. When I was considering my career path as a young hard-charger, that didn't seem like much of a drawback. Now that I am older and a little more burnt out, those 3 years down in Pensacola that some of my buddies are doing seem like a lot better way to go.
If you do end up with a FAC tour through the MAG, try to get with LAR or tanks-- their FACs don't deploy on a MEU. If not them, figure out which battalions are slated for SPMAGTF or Black Sea Rotational Force and try to get orders there. Basically, try to avoid the MEU. Even if you loved your MEU experience as a rotor or Harrier guy, I will venture to say that a peacetime MEU deployment as a FAC is not nearly as cool.
I am 10 months into my 18 month FAC tour with an infantry battalion. Originally it was supposed to be a 12 month tour, however the unit's deployment slid but my report date didn't. I think some of the differences between my experience and those who loved their tours might be because of the east coast vs west coast culture. You WILL stay on your current coast unless you fill a FAC billet through the monitor (recon/ anglico/ marsoc).
If I had to do it over again, I would not have volunteered for a FAC tour, at least not with a normal battalion. I would have tried to get orders to Recon or ANGLICO. You come out of TACP school the same, but the JTACs at those places get better equipment, more funding, and better training. Also, in my experience there is less of a parade ground mentality in those units. The drawback is that usually the orders are 24 months, but I'll be close to that anyways. One of the biggest drawbacks is when you get back from your FAC deployment you will go right back to a squadron that's about to deploy. When I was considering my career path as a young hard-charger, that didn't seem like much of a drawback. Now that I am older and a little more burnt out, those 3 years down in Pensacola that some of my buddies are doing seem like a lot better way to go.
If you do end up with a FAC tour through the MAG, try to get with LAR or tanks-- their FACs don't deploy on a MEU. If not them, figure out which battalions are slated for SPMAGTF or Black Sea Rotational Force and try to get orders there. Basically, try to avoid the MEU. Even if you loved your MEU experience as a rotor or Harrier guy, I will venture to say that a peacetime MEU deployment as a FAC is not nearly as cool.
Having just completed an LAR FAC tour, I'd agree that a non deploying FAC tour is not bad at all, especially if you are planning to return to the fleet. The recon jobs seemed cool too, and they are basically just air officers to supervise the training of a ton of JTAC's. They also didn't deploy.
How watertight are follow on orders back to a squadron on the same coast for a 12 month FAC tour? For a 24 month ANGLICO / MARSOC tour? Can it be stipulated before accepting the orders that you are guaranteed to go back to a squadron?
Here's the deal with that. There is a FAC order in existence that states that dudes on a FAC tour SHALL get follow on flying orders. That's the only guarantee. So it's a crapshoot as to whether or not you fly a grey aircraft or an orange one. With that being said, my experience was this. When I volunteered for mine, the PSD XO as well as the monitor asked for my top 3. I got my second choice which was back to my original fleet squadron.
The caveat is CCLEB. You will get screened and if selected you will go to school. At that point you will be even more of a priority to return to flying.
Ultimately needs of the Marine Corps prevail but a deploying FAC tour will give you first dibs on flying orders assuming your FAC FITREP didn't suck.