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Eye Exam

spongbob

Spongebob
So, I took the MEP's eye exam a few weeks back and I was told that I have 20/40 vision in my left eye and 20/25 in my right eye. Both eyes are correctable to 20/20 and therefore should pass the test to become a Navy pilot. However, my medical report identifies me as not qualified for pilot.

I decided to go to a eye doctor to double check and they said i had 20/30 in my left and 20/25 in my right which goes along with the MEP's exam, but my eye doctor also told me that both are correctable and I should have no issue meeting the requirement.

I don't understand why my vision doesn't pass the requirement. I would have accepted it and continued with another career however I just got my ASTB scores back today and I have a high chance of making it into flight school. Other than the fact that my eyesights a bit off without contacts I'm fully qualified.

Can anyone explain why or help me find a solution?
 

RUFiO181

Making Recruiting Great Again
There could be other items you didn’t pass such as color vision or depth perception.
 

spongbob

Spongebob
I did fail depth perception also, however I was never tested for it at MEP's. I did do the color vision test and past that. I assumed that depth perception was automatically connected the stigmatism in my left eye however when I went to my family eye doctor she also preformed a depth perception test which contained a list of 3D dots that became harder over time, I had no issue passing this part of the exam. This type of exam was never presented to me at the MEP's.
 

NavyOffRec

Well-Known Member
I did fail depth perception also, however I was never tested for it at MEP's. I did do the color vision test and past that. I assumed that depth perception was automatically connected the stigmatism in my left eye however when I went to my family eye doctor she also preformed a depth perception test which contained a list of 3D dots that became harder over time, I had no issue passing this part of the exam. This type of exam was never presented to me at the MEP's.
If depth perception wasn't performed at MEPS it would be noted on the physical and your OR should be able to get MEPS to actually perform it.

no offense to your family eye doctor, but the USN doesn't care if you had an eye exam from her or the homeless guy down the street, they don't accept either, it must be MEPS or MTF.
 

pilot_man

No longer the biggest Hornet asshole on AW.
pilot
If that is the case then why did the Navy give me a pilot slot after an optometrist said my depth perception was fine, even though the HM3 at MEPS said I failed the test? It’s been a while, but I don’t remember going back to MEPS after the actual eye dr.
 

RUFiO181

Making Recruiting Great Again
If that is the case then why did the Navy give me a pilot slot after an optometrist said my depth perception was fine, even though the HM3 at MEPS said I failed the test? It’s been a while, but I don’t remember going back to MEPS after the actual eye dr.
N3M won't accept supplemental information from civilian eye doctors anymore. If an applicant fails some portion of the eye test, he or she needs can retake at a military eye clinic - if they're lucky or have a hookup. Most MEPS won't allow retakes if the applicant clears the entire physical.
 

RUFiO181

Making Recruiting Great Again
I did fail depth perception also, however I was never tested for it at MEP's. I did do the color vision test and past that. I assumed that depth perception was automatically connected the stigmatism in my left eye however when I went to my family eye doctor she also preformed a depth perception test which contained a list of 3D dots that became harder over time, I had no issue passing this part of the exam. This type of exam was never presented to me at the MEP's.
You should have done everything at MEPS to include a basic eye exam, color vision test, and of course depth perception test. If in fact a DP test wasn't taken, your OR should be able to schedule you to get one done at MEPS. BE ADVISED, if you fail the DP test at MEPS you are more than likely done for SNA.
 

NavyOffRec

Well-Known Member
If that is the case then why did the Navy give me a pilot slot after an optometrist said my depth perception was fine, even though the HM3 at MEPS said I failed the test? It’s been a while, but I don’t remember going back to MEPS after the actual eye dr.
It changed several years ago, not sure if what I saw was the main reason, but I know several OR's including some at my NRD who would get civilian eye exams for those who failed DP or distance to get them qualified for SNA, in most cases those same individuals ended failing the exams at OCS and either redesignating or going home, waste of time for those candidates.
 

pilot_man

No longer the biggest Hornet asshole on AW.
pilot
That sounds like a horrible idea unless they actually use an optometrist to do the eye exams or at least the ones that fail the initial screen. I hope the Navy isn't turning away perfectly good candidates because they don't want the opinions of actual doctors.
 

UInavy

Registered User
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
That sounds like a horrible idea unless they actually use an optometrist to do the eye exams or at least the ones that fail the initial screen. I hope the Navy isn't turning away perfectly good candidates because they don't want the opinions of actual doctors.
Agreed. I failed the initial MEPS depth perception test (some box with three lines or something). I either re-took at MEPS or a civilian doctor and have passed about eleventy-nine depth perception exams in the Navy since then. Telling someone that they're done because they failed DP at MEPS once is something for an optometrist to say, not a message board.
 

Jim123

DD-214 in hand and I'm gonna party like it's 1998
pilot
"I've heard" that it's much, much easier to pick out those depth perception test circles if you move your head ever so slightly when you look at each row. :cool:
 

Hammer10k

Well-Known Member
"I've heard" that it's much, much easier to pick out those depth perception test circles if you move your head ever so slightly when you look at each row. :cool:
I did MEPS in early 2015, failed DP, and luckily the Navy accepted my civilian doc's DP test. Definitely used the above advice and haven't had a problem since then.
 

NavyOffRec

Well-Known Member
That sounds like a horrible idea unless they actually use an optometrist to do the eye exams or at least the ones that fail the initial screen. I hope the Navy isn't turning away perfectly good candidates because they don't want the opinions of actual doctors.
It is a tech who is specifically trained to only do the eye test, pretty sure they do more of the depth perception test than any optometrist would ever do, and yes there will be a few that fail at MEPS who would end up passing another test with a civilian and passing at OCS, but the point is that is the exception, far more from what I understood failed MEPS, passed civilian, then failed the test at OCS.
 

BACONATOR

Well-Known Member
pilot
Contributor
While things may have changed, I do enjoy when people say "No, that's not how it is" to people that literally DID do that. You can't say no that's impossible when someone DID it. You can only suggest "perhaps it's changed since then, but that's not allowed now".

That said...

The problem is you can get "in", only have issues where it counts at your OCS physical. When it was at Pcola, I did mine at NAMI, so the tests were probably all done properly. Not sure how it is done now via Newport, but I know that I've experienced MANY flight physicals from NAMI, to air force clinics, to the boat and the reserves, and I've seen all manner of poor conduct of tests. My boat experience included a 20+ year old PIP booklet that was very faded and had pen marks on it from tracing (which isn't allowed), and when I was puzzled trying to pick out the numbers, the PO at the end said "Yeah, everyone struggles with that". Gee... maybe because it's 20 years old, has pen all over it, is faded and, oh by the way, the test specifically delineates you're supposed to put the booklet under a specific lamp to ensure you are seeing it under the proper conditions, not the yellow glow of boat light.

I've seen corpsmen fuck up the FALANT, too. How many folks are disqualified for the young hospitalman who hasn't a fucking clue what the proper parameters are to conduct the test and/or has way outdated/miscalibrated equipment? It sucks, but at the very least at OCS I was confident they were doing it right (and I had no issues with the Ishihara PIP there, because he gave it to me under the proper specified lamp).

But I'm sure the Navy won't care until their qualified candidate pool drops to nothing... for a few years before they take notice, much like the people leaving the fleet.

And yes, @Jim123, you can utilize parallax by wiggling your head back and forth to make the circles "pop". This is all above-board and allowed on the test. You're only utilizing the phenomenon that the test is testing.
 

UInavy

Registered User
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
When in doubt, look up the reference (you're more likely to get a positive response with this info than 'Somebody told me on the internet...'). Bottom line: If you fail one test, you can try another. There are several acceptable.

From NAMI Aeromedical Reference and Waiver Guide:

"Valid tests of stereopsis include:
a. Armed Forces Vision Tester (AFVT) [passing is lines A through D]
b. Stereoacuity Plates used with polarized viewers such as the Stereo Optical, Titmus Optical Stereo Fly, or Randot. A randomized version of these tests should be used. Passing is 40 seconds of arc, with no head or test book movement, performed with good lighting.
c. Verhoeff Stereopter: tested at 1m, eight correct of eight random presentationsfor passing grade, with no head movement of the patient

2. A pass of any one test meets the stereopsis standard. The tests must be administered and results recorded as specified in MANMED and elsewhere in the ARWG."

and, from
AVIATION PHYSICAL STANDARDS FOR APPLICANTS MAY 2017 :
"Verhoeff : 8/8 to pass. If failed one or more, must repeat 2 series of 8 and candidate must have 16/16 correct in order to pass. AFVT: A-D to pass. Anything less than A-D=Fail. Other acceptable tests: Titmus or Randot Stereo 40 seconds to pass. If glasses required patient must wear them for testing and "with Rx" should be documented."
 
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