-
Please take a moment and update your account profile. If you have an updated account profile with basic information on why you are on Air Warriors it will help other people respond to your posts. How do you update your profile you ask?
Go here:
Edit Account Details and Profile
Daily Show: Marines in Berkeley
- Thread starter Python
- Start date
Sorry M0t....that is your mainstream Democratic party. There is nothing "fringe" about that. Pelosi and Reid and Obama say the same things as that asshole in the vid. And this is why the blue dog, Scoop Jackson/Joe Lieberman Dems are going to vote for McCain.
He was a helicopter pilot (or student pilot), and went PAO after he attrited. He's still a reserve Major, IIRC.
Yeah, but I bet one of them isn't that you loath the country and feel that the use of force on it's behalf is always wrong. Notice that I didn't say "vote Republican, go to church, wave a flag, wear a flag pin on the lapel, etc". Military service has nothing to do with politics, but whatever other motivations you may bring to the table, love of country and a desire to serve it are central for almost all. You will find your exceptions no doubt, but they are few and far between. Serving in the armed forces is one of the most patriotic things you can do, kind of the ultimate thank you for that big glass of freedom that you, your family, and your friends have been sipping on all your life. Don't try to take away the fact that it is a patriotic act from those who serve in order to try to put them on the same level as those whose highest service to the nation has been to protest. Their right to do so is important and protected, and educated dissent is an essential part of our society, but it is isn't on near the same level in terms of service and doesn't require the same dedication, and arguably, love of country.
Note your fellow left leaning poster who points out what a disservice the antics of a majority (yes I mean it) of your protesting pals on the left do to the legitimate concerns that many reasonable citizens hold. I am more than happy to read a thought out argument discussing objections to administration policy, but if you want me to listen to cheeky slogans from a bunch of empty headed twits who haven't seen a razor in a month and a real job in a decade then I am sorry, I'll pass. Bush lied, people died; blood for oil; etc :sleep_125 gag me.
And you would be wrong. Do you know me in the least? Do you know where I have been and who I have encountered in life? I didn't think so.
I don't have a problem with dissent nor with those that do so, so long as they do it in a reasoned, constructive way. I really don't care who you choose to vote for so long as you put thought into choosing how you will vote and why. I don't have any tolerance for those that drag our nation through the mud when they voice their dissent and I certainly don't think that you can say whatever vile thing you want about the country (say, that our military is an instrument of mass murder) and then claim to be just as patriotic as everyone else. Sorry if that cuts against one of your sacred cows.
You are right to observe that they hurt your credibility. However, there is nothing technical about it. They advocate total withdrawal from Iraq, the sooner the better, never mind the indications that the surge has provided an opportunity for success in Iraq. They absolutely oppose military pressure of any sort to deal with Iran. You can't honestly tell me that those are not central planks on Obama's platform, and those are just two of the national defense/military ones. I bet they probably are right with him on raising taxes (I forgot, the accepted vernacular is repealing the Bush tax cuts), health care, and any other social program that redistributes wealth. They are your fellow Democrats, no ifs, ands, or buts about it, sorry. If it hurts so bad that they agree with you and your party leaders then I submit that perhaps you should consider the quality of those positions....
Nsfw!!
I'm not a big fan of the Dems (and the Republicans can anger me, too), but I'll agree with m0t that they are no where near this bad: http://www.zombietime.com/hall_of_shame/
I'm not a big fan of the Dems (and the Republicans can anger me, too), but I'll agree with m0t that they are no where near this bad: http://www.zombietime.com/hall_of_shame/
You are right to observe that they hurt your credibility. However, there is nothing technical about it. They advocate total withdrawal from Iraq, the sooner the better, never mind the indications that the surge has provided an opportunity for success in Iraq. They absolutely oppose military pressure of any sort to deal with Iran. You can't honestly tell me that those are not central planks on Obama's platform, and those are just two of the national defense/military ones. I bet they probably are right with him on raising taxes (I forgot, the accepted vernacular is repealing the Bush tax cuts), health care, and any other social program that redistributes wealth. They are your fellow Democrats, no ifs, ands, or buts about it, sorry. If it hurts so bad that they agree with you and your party leaders then I submit that perhaps you should consider the quality of those positions....
Pretty sure this is not accurate. You can read between the lines and make a case for this statement, but he's never said anything like, "Military options are off the table with Iran," as far as I know.
Furthermore, I could care less about raising / lowering taxes. If one of the candidates came right out and said: my economic policy is to balance the budget (not just "said" it, but had the math all worked out, etc.), I would probably vote for them. We can't keep spending like we have over the last 8 years (4 of which were Republican controlled) with the current tax levels...this should be obvious?
All these make me want to do is go buy guns.
i just wanna hedge my bets against the rise of the anti-semite, anarchist/communist/nihilist radical far-left.
i just wanna hedge my bets against the rise of the anti-semite, anarchist/communist/nihilist radical far-left.
Huh? I hope you are joking......
You've got me, kinda. He hasn't said that, and yes, I am reading between the lines on his statements asserting the wisdom of diplomacy, nay, the audacious hope for a diplomatic resolution to Iran's unabashed nuclear ambitions. I am also reading between the lines of his opposition to the administration's decision to up the rhetoric against Iran and warned against hawkish policies, painting them as more of the same carelessness that led to Iraq, which he wisely was opposed to from the beginning, but fortunately never had to vote on it. Not his fault, remember, he wasn't in the Senate 6 years ago.
I agree with you on the the desire for a balanced budget and the GOP's woeful record on it during the past 8 years. I really wasn't arguing on what the appropriate level of taxation is, or what health care reforms, if any, should be federally mandated, or what the federal government should do with regard to environmental reforms. My point is that for the most part the rabid left holds the more or less the same views on the same issues as the Democratic leadership, their rank and file, and their recently anointed nominee. Just because they don't articulate it politely (or well) and don't wear a nice suit when they do so doesn't mean that they don't share the same views. mOt was/is trying to disown them because the way they go about expressing their views is often disgusting and embarrassing, and mOt is right. It is shameful that the people in the videos disrespect veterans and insult their sacrifice, but ultimately what they are advocating in terms of policy is an unconditional withdrawal from Iraq which is in large part a central plank of the Democratic party today. Whether you like it or not, when they pretty much walk the party line up and down in terms of their stances on the platform issues you can't pretend they aren't part of your party.
Note. Not a huge GOP fan by any means, but when forced to choose between the lesser of the two evils, I don't feel like I really even have a choice when it's between the modern Democratic party and pretty much anything else. Hopefully I will see an election in my time where I am offered a real choice and can find a candidate (that has a legitimate chance to be elected) I really trust to govern well. Let the breath holding commence.
No family of mine or people I know have been anything but supportive and encouraging of my decision to join the military, and a lot of my family / friends are Democrats. Just my experience..
Spekkio
He bowls overhand.
Military service has a lot to do with politics. We are the ultimate executioners of the administrations foreign "diplomacy." I don't see why someone would or should join the military if they disagree with the direction that our government has taken, as many people in the U.S. currently do with Iraq.
And while Code Pink's arguments are idiotic, I do think that it's a civic duty for Americans to put up a fight when they think the government is doing something unjust. Many of our founding fathers felt the same way. I don't think it's fair to call someone "unpatriotic" simply because they are speaking out for an opinion opposes our government.
An "opportunity for success" does not equate to a clear path to victory. The situation over there is still pretty murky, and a good portion, if not most, Americans want us out of the war as well.
As far as military options in Iran: that's a terrible idea, and not because force is bad or because I believe in a pacifist mantra. The terrain in Iran is about as unfavorable as you can get. The Iranian army, while not the best in the world, is far better than Iraq's was. You have Russia and China who like Iranian oil. And we also insist on conducting warfare with one hand tied behind our back so that we don't piss off other world leaders. And this is just the tip of the iceburg.
m0tbaillie
Former SWO
Sorry sir, but I have to respectfully yet firmly disagree. Of all the like-minded self-described democrats that I know, I can't think of a single one that would be that caustic, abrasive, radical-minded, and generally as stupid as the folks in those pictures and videos.
Show me a "mainstream" democrat that walks around at rallies doing the Nazi salute and punching/swearing at decorated veterans. I've never met a single one save for these idiots. Hence, why I made the comment about "live and let live". Most of the folks that I know who call themselves democrat and lean towards those viewpoints are of a mindset that you have to know which battles to pick and choose. This black-and-white absolutism being embraced by neo-cons and these "liberals" alike is absolutely retarded, nothing more, nothing less.
These people aren't democrats, they're ignorant, fringe idiots.
This. Except, I'm not pretending they're not considered part of my party, I'm crossing my fingers and wishing they weren't, because they're rapid retards and their ridiculously inarticulate, cliche, rhetoric looks like they pulled it out of a document entitled "Fwd: fwd fwd: FWD: 9/11 CONSPIRACY THEORY BUSH ZIONIST REGIME".
There's a difference between siding with the views of the majority of the democratic party (not Pelosi, because she's a fool) and expressing and articulating those opinions, platforms, and views with relative coherence...and mashing it up into a smorgasboard of retarded one-liners and childish slogans mixed with borderline violence and a contemptuous attitude towards veterans and active duty folks alike.
They may call themselves democrats, but those are no peers nor constituents of mine.
I would say a person really shouldn't join the military for the sole reason that they agree with the administration's decisions. A huge key to our military's success and our country's stability is the ability of military leaders to detach their professional actions from their political beliefs. If someone can't give or follow an order executing a policy they disagree with, we have BIG problems.
So it's irrelevant what I think about what we're doing in Iraq or elsewhere - I'm willing to go and drop bombs or do whatever else I'm ordered to do because even if I disagree with the action/policy politically, I support the system that produced it. And preserving a chain of command in which the military is securely subservient to civilian control is in the best interest of the republic.
Bottom line: a member of the military should express their political views in the voting booth, not on the battle field. And as long as they do, there's no reason someone who disagrees with US policy must not join the service (provided they don't have any moral or mental reservations that would prevent them from doing their job).