Correspondence Course Review

[KevinIRR]

I'm not really an Air Warrior, but I'm a Navy IRR member nearing retirement eligibility, and this looks like the best forum to talk about our concerns.

Today, I spoke with a couple of people at PERS, and here's my take away, in bullet point format:
- The purpose of these changes is to make the IRR "lean and mean"
- For enlisted, all enlistments/extensions must be approved by the commander, and he won't approve of anything for IRR that goes past 20 years. The current commander has been there for about four months, and I was told that he has shown "zero flexibility" on this. Forget that HYT for E-6 and above is actually longer than 20 years.

I realize that most members on here are officers, but this confirms or adds evidence to what you've been thinking about the "tone at the top". I can't find anything written about no enlistments past 20 years for anybody, but apparently that's the new practice. Forced retirements for everyone at 20 years regardless of HYT. Push 'em out.

And forget about returning to the SELRES if you've been away for very long. I've been trying without luck.

 

[vxc961]

I'm not really an Air Warrior, but I'm a Navy IRR member nearing retirement eligibility, and this looks like the best forum to talk about our concerns.

Today, I spoke with a couple of people at PERS, and here's my take away, in bullet point format:
- The purpose of these changes is to make the IRR "lean and mean"
- For enlisted, all enlistments/extensions must be approved by the commander, and he won't approve of anything for IRR that goes past 20 years. The current commander has been there for about four months, and I was told that he has shown "zero flexibility" on this. Forget that HYT for E-6 and above is actually longer than 20 years.

I realize that most members on here are officers, but this confirms or adds evidence to what you've been thinking about the "tone at the top". I can't find anything written about no enlistments past 20 years for anybody, but apparently that's the new practice. Forced retirements for everyone at 20 years regardless of HYT. Push 'em out.

And forget about returning to the SELRES if you've been away for very long. I've been trying without luck.

Thanks Kevin. It's interesting to hear that PERS is so forthright with the reasons behind the recent changes. Also, I think it's helpful to post/describe how a bluejacket can survive in the IRR as well.

I went SELRES after five (glorious!) years in the IRR, and it wasn't easy...but maybe it's even harder as an E. You might look at the guard though. Several years I had an O4 get booted with 17 good years. He was able to enlist as an E5 in the air guard to get his remaining 3 years.

 

[rob00000]

For enlisted, all enlistments/extensions must be approved by the commander, and he won't approve of anything for IRR that goes past 20 years. The current commander has been there for about four months, and I was told that he has shown "zero flexibility" on this.

Kevin, just wanted to add something here.

I spoke to PERS around 18 months ago or so because I will need a short extension of 60 days or so to have my 20 years in. I asked about a longer extension and was told 20 years was it! This was before they brought in HYT in the IRR so that was not the issue & they would not allow me to do more then 20 years.

I just want you to know it's not this one commanders idea to set the limit at 20. You said he's only been there 4 months & this happened long before he got there. He's just continuing the policy that was in place when he got there.

Anyway, now that they have removed the non resident courses as means of getting retirement points & are making it harder to get a good year then I'm glad to be out at 20 now. It's OK with me. If I can get 20 with a pension I'll count my blessings & be very happy & content about it.

Keep the faith & it will all work out in the end.

Rob

 

[KevinIRR]

It's good that the O4 was able to continue in the guard to get his retirement.

I entered the IRR as an E-6 YN1 in 2006 with 10 good years of active/SELRES time. It was a tough decision, because I enjoyed being part of the military even if it was just one weekend each month. I had recently moved to Japan with my civilian job (financial industry in Tokyo) and managed to drill for a few months with a flexible arrangement where I was attached to an active duty command at Yokosuka. However, the civilian job hours became long (Japan work culture really is crazy; everything you've heard and more is true) and it became impossible to arrange times where both the active duty command wanted me and I could be available. So I went IRR. Did courses and re-enlisted a few times.

The policy for re-enlistments in the IRR has changed over the years. Years ago, the policy was that an IRR member could only re-enlist for two years. I think I tested that by requesting three or four years early on, and they gave me two. I found a Captain who re-enlisted me about once each year (you can request re-enlistment within one year of EOS). Then about two years, it seems like there was a window where they would approve longer enlistments. I put three years on my request and surprisingly they gave it to me. Now I wish I had put five more years on that request. That put my EOS at March 2016. I hit 20 years this summer.

According to PERS, there was a window of time when pretty much all requests for re-enlistments were approved regardless of years, and that closed about two years ago (maybe very shortly after my last re-enlistment). I was told that my current EOS which takes me to about 20.7 years would be honored, but there's zero possibility now for extending to HYT of 22.

Recently, I returned to stateside and my new civilian job has U.S.-style work/life balance. So one of the first things I wanted to do was start drilling again (this was before I even knew about the 20 year limit for IRR). After talking with several recruiters, here's the feedback. Keep in mind that I have 19 good years with 9 years in IRR:
- For every six years that you spend in IRR, you will be reduced in rate by one level upon re-entering the Navy SELRES, if they take you.
- Therefore, I would go back as an E-5 which has HYT of 20 years, so that would leave almost no time to serve.
- National Guard recruiter said that no unit would want to touch me, because I have 19 years. I would go to basic training and be a beginner, but could retire at any moment.

If there's any way I could continue serving as a reservist, I'm interested. Civilian occupation is CPA/financial analyst.

Otherwise, I'm trying to get the maximum number of retirement points allowed has I head for the finish line.

 

[KevinIRR]

Kevin, just wanted to add something here.

I spoke to PERS around 18 months ago or so because I will need a short extension of 60 days or so to have my 20 years in. I asked about a longer extension and was told 20 years was it! This was before they brought in HYT in the IRR so that was not the issue & they would not allow me to do more then 20 years.

I just want you to know it's not this one commanders idea to set the limit at 20. You said he's only been there 4 months & this happened long before he got there. He's just continuing the policy that was in place when he got there.

Anyway, now that they have removed the non resident courses as means of getting retirement points & are making it harder to get a good year then I'm glad to be out at 20 now. It's OK with me. If I can get 20 with a pension I'll count my blessings & be very happy & content about it.

Keep the faith & it will all work out in the end.

Rob

Rob - I'm just starting to look at the retirement process. Could you explain how it went for you? Did PERS send you a flag and thank you for your service?

It looks to me like a person could easily screw up and not request retirement in the proper window (3-6 months before EOS). Without the signed request in place, a person becomes a "former member" rather than gray-area retiree. They can still request pay at age 60, but it will be less than for someone who properly did their paperwork. The reason is because pay for the gray-area retiree will based on current pay charts when they hit age 60, while pay for the former member will be based on pay charts from when they became a former member.

I heard from PERS that there are people who screw up, and when it's too late, it's too late. Something to keep in mind for yourself or when you counsel others.

 

[Flash]

...Several years I had an O4 get booted with 17 good years. He was able to enlist as an E5 in the air guard to get his remaining 3 years.

Very small world, I think that is the same guy (how many fit that exact description?) described to me in my first reserve unit several years ago. One of the folks knew him and used him as a cautionary tale to make sure you got good years. On the plus side we have a guy retiring next month out of my unit who was able to get an extension out to 24 years because he was short 3 or 4 good years as an O-4. Good guy and it worked out for him, glad the Navy let him finish it out.

 

[Randy Daytona]

I'm not really an Air Warrior, but I'm a Navy IRR member nearing retirement eligibility, and this looks like the best forum to talk about our concerns.

Today, I spoke with a couple of people at PERS, and here's my take away, in bullet point format:
- The purpose of these changes is to make the IRR "lean and mean"
- For enlisted, all enlistments/extensions must be approved by the commander, and he won't approve of anything for IRR that goes past 20 years. The current commander has been there for about four months, and I was told that he has shown "zero flexibility" on this. Forget that HYT for E-6 and above is actually longer than 20 years.

I realize that most members on here are officers, but this confirms or adds evidence to what you've been thinking about the "tone at the top". I can't find anything written about no enlistments past 20 years for anybody, but apparently that's the new practice. Forced retirements for everyone at 20 years regardless of HYT. Push 'em out.

And forget about returning to the SELRES if you've been away for very long. I've been trying without luck.

You are confirming everything I thought.

 

[rob00000]

Rob - I'm just starting to look at the retirement process. Could you explain how it went for you? Did PERS send you a flag and thank you for your service?

I'm not there yet Kevin! I've got 14 months to go till I hit 20 big ones!

Oh....and they don't have to thank me for my service. As long as they deposit my retirement check monthly in my account that's thanks enough!

 

[RHINOWSO]

I'm over 60 days for some JKO courses and they haven't been credited, person I talked to said their was a backlog - typical navy eh?

 

[Randy Daytona]

How did you submit your JKO courses?

 

[RHINOWSO]

Faxed them in. Probably going to print and snail mail them as well if they aren't credited before the end of the month (May anniversary).

 

[snake020]

I'm over 60 days for some JKO courses and they haven't been credited, person I talked to said their was a backlog - typical navy eh?

I mailed mine in 2 March and they were up two weeks later.

 

[RHINOWSO]

^^^^^^^
Not surprised in the least bit. I guess I'll print and mail them tomorrow, as PERS912s fax privileges must have been cut off.

 

[N4Life]

I'm over 60 days for some JKO courses and they haven't been credited

I had -912 take 9 months to make a decision, they do like taking their time. In the 15 months that I have been in the Reserves, I only had 1 course approved for a grand total of 2 pts (8 pts if you include my anniversary).

I just got off the phone with -93, they said that on 1 June a new list of courses will be posted. They said to expect a number of courses to be removed and others to be added. They said courses not on the new list must be completed before 1 June, but they are not posting the new listing of what courses will be on the list until 1 June (and I had him repeat it twice).

 

[RHINOWSO]

I had -912 take 9 months to make a decision, they do like taking their time. In the 15 months that I have been in the Reserves, I only had 1 course approved for a grand total of 2 pts (8 pts if you include my anniversary).

I just got off the phone with -93, they said that on 1 June a new list of courses will be posted. They said to expect a number of courses to be removed and others to be added. They said courses not on the new list must be completed before 1 June, but they are not posting the new listing of what courses will be on the list until 1 June (and I had him repeat it twice).

Ops normal, eh? Play "I've got a secret"?

I guess I'll have to crank out as many as I can between my anniversary date and 1 June!