Apache vs. Cobra

[Attilla]

I've read a lot of posts about Tomcats, Hornets, and Migs, so.... I thought it was high time some chopper pilots threw in their two cents on which platform they either like to or would like to blow $h^t up with. (I know there aren't any army folks out there to defend the Apache, but I don't really care.)

"Would you like some freshly grated Romano cheese with your entree?"

 

[perchul]

well I'm a cobra fan, but I think its going to be hard to defend it against the technical merits of the apache

Tolerance only benefits the weak

 

[perchul]

well I did find this on globalsecurity.org to help the cobra, It is the only western attack helicopter with a proven air-to-air and anti-radar missile capability.

Tolerance only benefits the weak

 

[Spin]

A Gunny at my recruiting office worked on Cobras. He said the main thing that distinguished the Cobra from the Apache (in his eyes) is that the Apache has always had significant problems in the field where as the Cobra has had little to none.

 

[Dave Shutter]

The dependability issue has often come up with people in the know who I've talked to, both in the Army and now. The Cobra's sillhouette also makes it ideal for shipboard operations and then there's parts commonality with the Huey, which the USMC also still uses. The new AH-1Z (rebuilt from the ground up, not just a paintjob with add-ons) is supposed to have a lot of the capabilities of the Apache: 4-bladed rotor, avionics, defensive measures, Hellfires, Sidewinders, improved IR sighting and aquisition...etc. It doesn't have the big radar dome on the mast like the Longbow, but I don't think you'll hear too many Marines complain about that given the other improvements.

 

[perchul]

Would these improvents include the ability to aim the canon in the direction the pilot is looking? I love that.

Tolerance only benefits the weak

 

[vegita1220]

I thought it was where the gunner looks? Anyway, correct me if I'm wrong but they have diffrent missions right?
Cobra to provide beachhead support, and chopper superiority(is that a real word). So the Cobra would benefit from lots and lots of bullets rockets and missiles...and other things that just go boom.
Apache to do deep strikes behind enemy lines. Needs Longbow to shoot and stay out of sight.

 

[perchul]

good point about the gunner, but either way does it do that?


Tolerance only benefits the weak

 

[phrogdriver]

The Army uses the Apache as a manuever element. They move independently on the battlefield. Essentially, they're a tank that's very fast and can move over any terrain. Accordingly, they operate in large flights. The Longbow radar allows the Longbow Apache to spot targets and actually designate targets for other AH-64s. They don't escort other helicopters and don't often work CAS.

Cobras' primary jobs are CAS and escorting other helos. They usually work in sections of 2, so the high-speed datalink stuff is not as necessary. They have very much equivalent weaponry, but fewer gizmos. They use NVGs, while 64s use a FLIR almost exclusively.

Phrogs phorever

 

[meat]

A few inconsistencies about the above posts. Either pilot can shoot off axis using their helmet to sight just depends on which way they've decided to set it up. The W has flir though not as nice as the Apache until the Z goes through. The W can shoot all of the same ordnance types as the Apache plus the Side-winder/arm just no agm-114L (for the Longbow). The W just can't carry as much, there is a pretty good size difference.

 

[Attilla]

Just to interject, the only two Cobra pilots that I have ever spoken to are both airline pilots.
Not necessarily on the subject, but I hope that helps to debunk the myth that chopper pilots cannot get airline jobs.

 

[stevew]

This was touched on when we spoke about which jets were better, ours or the MIG's. Someone said that even though the Russians may have better aircraft the US pilots are better trained. Therefore, if it were to come down to it even though the Russians could outmaneuver us we are still the better trained pilots and would end up on top. I think the same holds true with the Apache vs. the Cobra. I don't know the detailed specs on either of them but I have always heard that the Apache is the best chopper out there. However, in Iraq no Cobras were shot down, not something the Apache's can say for themselves, so despite which is better it seems that the Corps pilots are better trained than the army pilots. -Not a suprise. This, is just my observation, feel free to disagree.

Steve

 

[DustydogCSAR]

Its not really a matter of training as much as a matter of tactics. without getting too specific Army hovers while the Marines use fly-in tactics. Both have benefits and drawbacks. Hover benefit is easier targeting while the drawback is it's a big target (Read Blackhawk Down). Fly-in just the opposite. Battle damage in both OEF and OIF make me lean towards the Marine tactic.
Weaponeering is another factor. AGM-114L (Army Only) is a radar guided weapon while the 114K is laser.
Lastly the current Cobra is a pig. The Apache is a sportscar, but the Marines make up for the reduced manueverabilty by better tactics.
Again just my opinion... I've worked with the cobra guys and only talked to apache guys.
Ike