Airlines and Safety

[A4sForever]

FAA Wants Some Boeing Jet Insulation Replaced


[font=Verdana,Sans-Serif]Friday April 1, 1:20 PM EST

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WASHINGTON (AP)--Airlines would have to replace or upgrade old insulation in more than 800 Boeing (BA) jetliners to meet newer, more stringent fire safety standards, under a rule proposed Friday by the U.S. aviation agency.

John Hickey, director of the Federal Aviation Administration's aircraft certification service, said the agency does not believe the problem poses an imminent danger. But, he said, "Fire and airplanes are a bad mix, so when you have the opportunity to reduce the risk you take it."

Airlines will get six years to complete the work.

Canadian investigators have said that Swissair Flight 111 plunged into the ocean off the Nova Scotia coast in 1998 after a fire that was fed by insulation in the cockpit. All 229 people aboard were killed.

[/font]As a result of that crash, the FAA in 2000 required airlines to replace their insulation if it was the kind used in the Swissair plane, an MD-11. About 700 Boeing and McDonnell-Douglas aircraft had to swap out the insulation that was installed between the jet's aluminum skin and the cabin.

The deadline for that costly retrofit is June 30. Insulation has been replaced on about 90% of the aircraft.

The FAA set higher fireproofing standards for insulation in 2003, but the problem with the insulation covered by Friday's proposal had not been fully analyzed.

In 2002, burnt insulation found in a jetliner on the ground led Boeing to look into the fireproof properties of that insulation's covering, which was made of a different substance than the insulation that the FAA had ordered removed.

Investigations by the FAA and Boeing of that incident and some others led to the conclusion that the film used to cover the insulation didn't meet the 2003 standard.

Boeing believes that age and contamination had affected the film's fireproof properties. The film was made between 1981 and 1988 and the FAA believes it was installed on 831 U.S.-registered Boeing 700-series jetliners.

Boeing also argues that age and contamination reduce the fire resistance of all kinds of insulation. The company has urged the FAA to look into insulation used throughout the aviation industry.

The FAA says its research shows that aging doesn't diminish the fireproof qualities of insulation.......

 

[Schnugg]

The chances of this causing a fire is so slim...is this overkill.

 

[A4sForever]

The chances of this causing a fire is so slim...is this overkill.

Totally, completely, uncompromisingly, without hesitation or reservation, AGREE !!! And at a time when the airlines are struggling financially ??? It's almost like something else is in play here --- long term ????

 

[HAL Pilot]

A S-3 bubba once told me they had the same type of wiring and there was a fleet-wide replacement. Don't know if it is true or not.

 

[SteveG75]

Kapton wiring.

Very prevalent in the Prowlers. Or I should say "was" very prevalent. As the jets get reworked, it gets replaced, but no-one knows how much is in each jet.

EA-6B NATOPS states that circuit breakers will not be reset unless "operational necessity" dictates due to the danger of electrical fires.

Brett and Flash may remember the VAQ-142 bird that went down outside of PSAB several years ago. Rudder throw light, AEB temp light, uncommanded pitching = 4 ejections. Crew had all the indications of a fire in the aft equipment bay but it was actually an electrical fire and the pitching was caused by spurious autopilot commands.

Kapton wiring.


As for the FAA, I recommend reading "Flying Blind. Flying Safe" by May Schiavo. Remember, the FAA has two missions. One is avaiation safety, the other is to promote air travel. They are not necessarily complimentary.

 

[Schnugg]

Gotcha and on April Fools Day...

Totally, completely, uncompromisingly, without hesitation or reservation, AGREE !!! And at a time when the airlines are struggling financially ??? It's almost like something else is in play here --- long term ????

Actually sort of pulled the pin on that grenade and tossed it in the frey just to see A4s reaction....he bit.

Set the hook and reel him in.


Clearly safety should never be compromised....

r/
G

 

[ChuckMK23]

The bottom line (I think) is still the abrasion of wire insulation within a wire bundle. This mixed with any kind of moisture will cause "explosive" arcing. This explosive arcing is very very hot - in excess of 1000 degrees F. When surrounded by insulation film/blankets that are even remotely flammable you are talking serious, serious fire.

 

[A4sForever]

Actually sort of pulled the pin on that grenade and tossed it in the frey just to see A4s reaction....he bit.

Set the hook and reel him in.


Clearly safety should never be compromised....

r/
G

My Dear "Schnugg":

Very Jolly .... Ah, you're so clever, Schnugg, ..... and here I thought you were trying to be constructive -- silly me. Who said anything about compromising safety --- ??? We're still waiting ..... ?? I'm talking about bureacratic overkill by people who have another agenda --- perhaps like yourself on this thread ???

Patmack's "old man's concern " take on another, new, P.C. unfunded mandate by the feds is MY concern here --- not safety. I think some on this forum have spent too many years working(?) in an environment where you never have to pay the bill$ -- just pass along the co$t to the U.$. taxpayer .... the airlines do not have that luxury. Of course, if you do not work in a profit/loss oriented business --- this concept might elude you.

I'm well aware of air safety having worked on safety issues at two airlines and in the Navy -- probably a hell of a lot more than yourself. I also worked on setting the parameters for the FFDO program (safety?) -- took many hits on that one -- and the initial operational "safety" issues involved in flying into mainland (Communist) China. But I digress ..... and need not explain nor justify my commitment to safety to anyone here. How do you think I lasted this long if I am "cavalier" re: SAFETY ??? Oh, that's right --- it wasn't about "safety" in the first place.

Other's opinions are always welcome and are sometimes of value in this subject area. No one has all the answers -- certainly not I. I get sooooo sick of some people on this forum who take perverse delight in starting "flame wars". I guess I will just have to suck it up and live with the fact that I'm an easy target since I reside at/near the top of the Aviation food chain ...

But --- if YOU are more interested in playing some kind of mind game here to "trick" ol' A4s --- and with your vast airline and FAA knowledge to boot -- I would suggest YOU go play with yourself.

 

[Schnugg]

As you were....

Snap. (I love that word when it gets zinged on a post)

Signing out as I always do...an XO antagonizing JO at heart.

Cheers,
G

 

[ChuckMK23]

A4s -

Just curious... in the event of a uncontrolled fire - how quickly are you guys able to get the mighty 747 down from cruise alt? Do you guys practice this kind of extemis in the sim? What's the thought process on finding some place to put her down?

 

[A4sForever]

A4s -

Just curious... in the event of a uncontrolled fire - how quickly are you guys able to get the mighty 747 down from cruise alt? Do you guys practice this kind of extemis in the sim? What's the thought process on finding some place to put her down?

It's tough .... Where's the fire located? On the aircraft, I mean .... the Whale is a big airplane with a big wing and over the Pacific --- there's usually no place to "get down" to expediciously ... got to fight it onboard or you die.

I always brief my F/A's on the potential hazards, our 'game plan' and it usually gets their attention ..... as they are the front-line troops in this situation.

 

[A4sForever]

US FAA Probes Trinidad Jet, American Air Jet Near Miss

[font=Verdana,Sans-Serif]Monday April 25, 9:02 PM EDT [/font]



[font=Verdana,Sans-Serif]PORT-OF-SPAIN, Trinidad (AP)--A Trinidad commercial airliner and an American Airlines flight came close enough to each other over the weekend that both planes had to take emergency measures to avoid a potential collision, officials said Monday.

BWIA Flight 431 was about 15 miles (25 kilometers) southwest of Miami International Airport after taking off Saturday afternoon for Barbados when the pilot received an instruction from radar controllers to maintain an altitude of 7,000 feet (2,100 meters), said Kathleen Bergen, a spokeswoman for the U.S. Federal Aviation Administration.

The BWIA pilot did not acknowledge the transmission and the 737 plane kept climbing, Bergen said. American Airlines Flight 2198 was nearby, flying level at 8,000 feet (2,400 meters), she said.

The American flight's traffic collision and avoidance system activated and the pilot climbed the 757 plane and turned it away from the BWIA flight, Bergen said.

The FAA spokeswoman could not say how close the two planes came to each other but said it is a "fairly uncommon occurrence" for a traffic collision and avoidance system to activate. Bergen could not confirm that the BWIA plane's alert system activated but the Trinidad airline confirmed that it had.

The FAA investigation could take several weeks, but the preliminary results show that the BWIA pilot was at fault because he didn't follow instructions from radar controllers, Bergen said.

BWIA said it was investigating the incident and that more than 200 passengers were aboard the plane. It was not immediately clear how many passengers were aboard the American flight or its destination.

The BWIA pilot followed the alert system's instructions and the plane took a sudden sharp dip away from the American flight, almost like a nosedive, creating panic among the passengers, airline spokeswoman Dionne Ligoure said.

Several passengers aboard the BWIA flight later reported that the other plane was so close they could see the American Airlines logo, Ligoure said.

BWIA has been on the brink of financial collapse. Earlier this month, the government granted a $35.6 million bailout package for BWIA and suspended several flights to the Caribbean and Europe in an effort to save costs.

American Airlines parent company, AMR Corp. (AMR), is based in Fort Worth, Texas. The airline could not immediately provide information on the incident.

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[A4sForever]

Threat from Volcano Ash Increasing ??

A U.S. Geological Survey (USGS) report, released on April 29, is the "latest evidence of the growing threat that volcanic ash poses to aviation, and underscores the urgent need to fully fund the National Volcano Early Warning System," declared Capt. Terry McVenes, ALPA's Executive Air Safety Chairman. The USGS report, Framework for a National Volcano Early Warning System (www.usgs.gov/newsroom), was released at a Capitol Hill briefing that included Capt. Ed Miller, leader of ALPA's Volcanic Ash and Aviation Safety Project, among the presenters.

The report highlights volcanoes in U.S.-controlled airspace that are currently under-monitored and could pose a serious threat to aviation, including Mts. Pagan, Agrigan, Alamagan, Guguan, and Asuncion in the Mariana Islands; Mts. Vsevldof and Kiska in Alaska; Mono Craters in California; Crater Lake in Oregon; and Glacier Peak in Washington.

"You wouldn't sail rough seas without a life preserver," said Capt. Miller. "We shouldn't ignore volcanoes that we know are dangerously under-monitored."

Of particular concern to ALPA are the active volcanoes in the Marianas Islands, a U.S. territory located in the North Pacific Ocean, which USGS reports pose a significant threat to aviation. Only two of the volcanoes have some ground-based, real-time monitoring, and six have no ground-based monitoring at all. The Marianas fall in the path of many U.S. flights bound for Hong Kong and Manila.

"One flight crosses over the Marianas Islands roughly every 22 minutes," said Capt. Miller. "With so much at risk, the USGS needs to be equipped to conduct full monitoring of the Marianas volcanoes to protect the thousands of travelers flying across the Pacific."

"The five-minute warning that pilots received during the Mount St. Helens eruption in 2004 proved that the USGS system works," continued Capt. McVenes. "That's the kind of warning system pilots need for every volcano, and it can only happen through the USGS monitoring program."

"The North Pacific averages five or six eruptions each year, with volcanic ash falling close enough to flight routes to become an aviation safety concern on as many as 12 days a year," continued Capt. Miller.

With the growing number of passengers choosing to travel by air, and the increasing number and density of flights passing near active volcanoes, ALPA strongly advocates that to protect passengers, crew and cargo:

• Congress must fund the USGS National Volcano Early Warning System. This system would ensure that Volcanic Ash Advisory Centers-satellite-based and ground based systems for detecting eruptions-are enhanced.
• SGS should have the capability to implement the "5-minute" warning, which is designed to alert air traffic control centers of an ash-producing eruption within five minutes of the start of the eruptive event. The 5-minute warning is essential, as an ash cloud can take only 5 minutes to reach flight level altitudes above 20,000 feet, aircraft can approach at rates of 5 miles per minute (300 miles per hour), and pilots need time to divert and avoid the cloud.

 

[A4sForever]

Air Midwest Apologizes For Deadly 2003 Commuter Crash

[font=Verdana,Sans-Serif]Friday May 6, 7:38 PM EDT [/font]



[font=Verdana,Sans-Serif]CHARLOTTE, N.C. (AP)--A small airline apologized Friday for the 2003 crash of a commuter plane that stalled after takeoff and plummeted into a hangar, killing 21.

"We are truly sorry, and regret and apologize to everyone affected by this tragic event," Greg Stephens, president of Air Midwest, said at a memorial service where the plane went down at Charlotte/Douglas International Airport.

He also said the airline and its maintenance provider, Vertex Aerospace, acknowledged "deficiencies" that contributed to the accident. The twin-engine Beech 1900 commuter plane took off normally on Jan. 8, 2003, but within seconds, its nose pitched up sharply and the aircraft stalled. The plane rolled left and crashed into a maintenance hangar.

Investigators for the National Transportation Safety Board said improperly rigged cables that controlled the aircraft's up-and-down motion combined with too much weight in the back of the plane led to the crash. Investigators also found the plane had been maintained by a mechanic who wasn't trained to work on that model of aircraft.

The apology was demanded by the parents of 18-year-old college student Christiana Shepherd, who died in the crash on her way back from the Azores Islands off the coast of Portugal, where her parents worked as missionaries.

Doug and Tereasa Shepherd had refused to settle a lawsuit against the companies without an apology.

"The loss of a child, sibling, spouse or parent is devastating to any family; all that can be done to avoid such loss should and must be done," the couple said in a statement. "The bottom line must always be people, not profit."
The Shepherds' attorney, Ron Goldman, said the couple was the last to settle with the airline, but he declined to provide any details of the amount.

Air Midwest, a subsidiary of Mesa Air Group (MESA), operates mainly as US Airways Express (UAIRQ), providing connecting flights from major hubs to smaller cities in the Midwest and on the East Coast. It is headquartered in Wichita, Kan.
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