AH-1W vs Mi24

[Patriot]

For all you Snake pilots out there, for close air support how do you think the Hind measures up against the AH-1W. I won't even ask about A/A that one's easy Any experiences of seeing them in action? I know the Poles have them and the Iraqis did.

 

[Gatordev]

I believe the US Army has one or two, as well. You may be getting into OPSEC if you want specifics, but I'm sure Skidkid will chime in.

 

[phrogdriver]

For all you Snake pilots out there, for close air support how do you think the Hind measures up against the AH-1W. I won't even ask about A/A that one's easy Any experiences of seeing them in action? I know the Poles have them and the Iraqis did.

I'm not a Cobra guy, but I'll start. The AH-1 will wipe the floor with the Hind.

The Hind has little night capability, at least without the upgrade package. I don't think most variants are even NVG-compatible, and it doesn't have a FLIR like the Cobra. It's an unmanueverable pig, having a cargo bay in the back for a squad (-). However,it can use that to self-FARP, which is nice. The FSU pilots flew it a lot like an airplane--no Nap-of-the-Earth. Its armament, esp its missiles, are not up to the standard of a Hellfire, or even a TOW. It could rip up some Muhajadeen before they got Stingers, but once they got those, it was all over. The Cobra has done pretty well against similar forces in Iraq, with (based on media accounts) only 2 losses that could be attributed to enemy fire.

The newer Havoc and Hokum may be better opponents, but they both have had very limited production runs and little export success.

 

[Texan]

What about some of the European (Eurocopter) helo's. The Panther is the armed variant of the -635 Dauphin (the Coast guard Dolphin), the Cougar is the equivalent of the CH53, the Tiger is on par with the Apache / Cobra, and the NH90 is even bigger than the Cougar (and probably more on point with the CH53) being able to carry a good 20 fully loaded troops.

any comments on any of those?

 

[Blutonski816]

The newer Havoc and Hokum may be better opponents, but they both have had very limited production runs and little export success.

I don't think the hokum is really worth counting anyway... I think someone mentioned it here before, but a one-seat attack helo is one of those "it'll never really work" ideas....

 

[skidkid]

It is always dificult when comparing aircraft especially keeping it all uncalssified. I would echo waht Phrogdriver said. The Hind is big and carries lots of ordnance but has some sever limitation in avionics, ergonomics and training. They do however have some very good missiles and there are some upgrade packages available that adress the avionics issue.

I have flown against the Hind and keeping this purposefully vague it is fast but doesnt manuever very well. It would not be my first choice as a CAS player. The Eurocopter tiger by all accounts is very good, as is the Mangusta and Rooivalk-that one has a pretty good track record flying counter insurgency ops in S Africa.

As for the Hokum I beleive the production verson will have two seats. It however has many of the same problems the Hind does it is big and fast, it kind of combines all the weaknesses of a f/w aircraft with all the weaknesses of a r/w aircraft.

 

[Ryoukai]

^ So...what are the good points of the Hokum? I'm assuming that looking freggin' cool doesn't help one in flight.

 

[skidkid]

The Hokum is fast as sh!t and has good avionics and some really scary missiles but when the Zulu get AIM-9X it wont matter so much any more.

 

[TurnandBurn55]

No kidding? Y'all are getting AIM-9X and JHMCS in the Cobra?

 

[skidkid]

In theory yes. The cockpit is alreadty set up for helmet sights for the gun so it is not a big deal to integrate the 9X. In theory of course right now there are some helmet issues so we'll see. There will be two wingtip stations that can only carry the AIM-9. I wouldnt mind replacing at least one of them wiht an ECM pod but oh well.

 

[ChuckMK23]

I believe the US Army has one or two, as well. You may be getting into OPSEC if you want specifics, but I'm sure Skidkid will chime in.

There are a number of Mi-24's operated by E-Systems. I believe they are used at the National Training Centre for the Army - but have appeared elsewhere in CONUS. They were overhauled and completed at Crestview - Bob Sikes airport of all places. The hanger is in the SE corner of the airfield. Used to crack me up to fly an RI or BI into CEW and see a Hind sitting there turning on the taxiway.

Anyways, the MI-24 although impressive looking is not anything to be overly impressed with - it's a big aircraft but it has historically been underpowered even on relatively low DA conditions.

 

[skidkid]

we fought one in El Paso, I didnt but the squadron did

 

[phrogpilot73]

I got a chance to fly against one in Yuma (yea, during the class)... No fun being an assault support guy, they schwacked me. Not as quickly as the snakes did though...

 

[TheBubba]

There are a number of Mi-24's operated by E-Systems. I believe they are used at the National Training Centre for the Army - but have appeared elsewhere in CONUS. They were overhauled and completed at Crestview - Bob Sikes airport of all places. The hanger is in the SE corner of the airfield. Used to crack me up to fly an RI or BI into CEW and see a Hind sitting there turning on the taxiway.

Anyways, the MI-24 although impressive looking is not anything to be overly impressed with - it's a big aircraft but it has historically been underpowered even on relatively low DA conditions.

Yeah... you see some interesting stuff at CEW... They are doin stuff mod-ing Hercs right now... SE corner of the field...

 

[Fly Navy]

There are a number of Mi-24's operated by E-Systems. I believe they are used at the National Training Centre for the Army - but have appeared elsewhere in CONUS. They were overhauled and completed at Crestview - Bob Sikes airport of all places. The hanger is in the SE corner of the airfield. Used to crack me up to fly an RI or BI into CEW and see a Hind sitting there turning on the taxiway.

Anyways, the MI-24 although impressive looking is not anything to be overly impressed with - it's a big aircraft but it has historically been underpowered even on relatively low DA conditions.

There is a white Mi-24 and a white Mi-8 at Destin-Ft Walton Beach. I think the Mi-8 is called Vodka 1