Harrier Dude
Living the dream
Exactly. It should have been all in from the start. If we don't have the stomach for what that means, then let's just do what we can to limit the damage.
My vote is for all in, full fury, scorched earth.
-
Please take a moment and update your account profile. If you have an updated account profile with basic information on why you are on Air Warriors it will help other people respond to your posts. How do you update your profile you ask?
Go here:
Edit Account Details and Profile
Significant Event in the Harrier Force
- Thread starter usmarinemike
- Start date
Exactly. It should have been all in from the start. If we don't have the stomach for what that means, then let's just do what we can to limit the damage.
My vote is for all in, full fury, scorched earth.
This is not a "win-lose" deal. I respect your opinions on all subjects and do not pretend to have most of the answers myself. Two conclusions I draw from the events of the past 7-10 days: (a) Subjugating facts to policy doesn't work for any administration, and (b) We must provide sufficient security for our embassies/consulates in the Mideast or we will lost more people.
By all-in, I meant not quitting in getting the Afghans ready to take over for us if they aren't, the TB will be back in charge the moment we leave. The new directive to cease partnered ops below battalion level has me worried that we're just going to hunker down in force pro mode till 2014.
Same as the British & Russians before us: Take our shit and go home.
And that's a good thing. Al Qaeda is no longer a player there (and won't be again, by most accounts), which was ostensibly the reason we went in. We'll keep enough specialized folks there to do the CT mission, but everyone else should get the fuck out. Besides, we're pivoting to PACOM now - hopefully a little less nasty.
Contractors (who aren't allow to engage in "combat"), Jordanians and Tongans.
The biggest mistake in this incident was letting the "locals" build their compounds just outside the wire along "shit river". We were saying that 2 years ago when I was there. The BLS complex is in the middle of nowhere and even though the bad guys wanted to hit the place, they couldn't get close enough without getting blasted because there was no place to hide.
It's a bit more complicated than that. Yes, foreign nationals or foreign contractors "defend" most embassies and compounds (really ID checks and vehicle inspections) but the host country military/police are the actual defenders. The Chancellery, the actual embassy building(s) are defended by the Marines who's true job is to protect property and not people.
State has been on a pretty aggressive New Embassy Building (NEC) program for the last few years and that's moving the embassies out to the edge of town where a force protection perimeter can be established. It's a standard design with the color/exterior materials designed to fit the local culture and they're pretty nice. Both Tripoli and Bengazi (and I've been to both) were little more updated nice houses. It won't be that way going forward.
I'll be advising one of their battalions starting next month. I'll let you know.
Jeez. Be safe, be lucky and be armed & careful !!
It bothers me that this Squadron CO who lost his life, that of another Marine, and a majority of squadron aircraft, are getting so little coverage/concern since the initial press report. Lots of continual handwringing/causal factors & excuse making re: the Libyan Consulate terrorist attack , but it seems like the Camp Bastion tragedy has been totally "ho hum'd" by all but the military (& us AWs). I haven't heard much concern from the CIC/DOD, or am I missing something here?
BzB
I haven't heard much concern from the CIC/DOD, or am I missing something here?
BzB
Probably not the kind of focus on Afghanistan an incumbent would desire a few months before the election. That's what my cynical side says. Less cynically (and, I think, less realistically) is the consideration that there were "only" 2 deaths here, despite the enormous and unusual loss of materiel, and the general public doesn't understand how significant it is for an O-5 aviator to be killed in action (on the ground, no less).
I agree, this should be getting much more coverage.
Since when has the DoD publicly aired concern about setbacks? I guarantee you the guys responsible for getting and giving CAS are giving it plenty of attention, but there's no need for it in the press. ISAF insisted that there would be no impact to air or ground operations at Bastion......shades of Baghdad Bob.
As for the press, the first reports were "Prince Harry is ok after attack on his base." What I've seen in the past - and this was no different - by the time the families are notified and the names are officially released, the press has moved on. There were a few mentions of his rank and the magnitude of the attack, but I don't think anyone in charge is going to want to advertise that they took a squadron out of action.
As for the press, the first reports were "Prince Harry is ok after attack on his base." What I've seen in the past - and this was no different - by the time the families are notified and the names are officially released, the press has moved on. There were a few mentions of his rank and the magnitude of the attack, but I don't think anyone in charge is going to want to advertise that they took a squadron out of action.
I won't try to comment about the aircraft losses and replacements- I don't know and it's none of my business.
Regarding the personnel losses, it is exceedingly rare, but this isn't the only time in OEF or OIF that a CO has been taken out of the picture (at least temporarily). What happens next is that good people step up to the challenge...
Here is what was also a significant event (though not as severe) for Marine Phrogs in 2004: link to "Pilot receives DFC." I've also seen something similar happen to a ground unit (Army Cav squadron) and the rest of the people there similarly pulled together and kept up with the mission.
It took me a bit of searching to find a good link for the HMM-161 story, and from here I'll leave the details to others who are better able to comment.