Great award winning article in Marine Corps Gazette by the prolific LtCol Glen Butler who isn't afraid to tilt at windmills.
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The End of the Officers Club
- Thread starter HeyJoe
- Start date
Excellent article ... Butler & I are of the same mind ... I'm going to re-read the piece several times ...
Bottom line: you guys MUST take back your traditions and way of life -- or all is lost.
"We" ... me & my Amigo's can't do it -- we're out. But we held up the line and held up the traditions and esprit de corps of those who came before us ... YOU need to do the same.
If you can't bring yourself to 'do it' because of career considerations ... what ARE you doing here, anyway -- in Naval Aviation???
Just waiting for retirement ... ??? How sad ...
Bottom line: you guys MUST take back your traditions and way of life -- or all is lost.
"We" ... me & my Amigo's can't do it -- we're out. But we held up the line and held up the traditions and esprit de corps of those who came before us ... YOU need to do the same.
If you can't bring yourself to 'do it' because of career considerations ... what ARE you doing here, anyway -- in Naval Aviation???
Just waiting for retirement ... ??? How sad ...
MasterBates
Well-Known Member
O'Club revival, saving AWGs, and building Katapults are all in the same vein.
Saving our traditions and legacy NEEDS to be done. And I can't do it alone. Write Hook/RotorReview/Proceedings articles, ask Flag Officers, support your Club.
Saving our traditions and legacy NEEDS to be done. And I can't do it alone. Write Hook/RotorReview/Proceedings articles, ask Flag Officers, support your Club.
I tried to breathe life into Maxwell AFB O-club by adopting a few ASBC kids as they came throught thier 6ish week course here... a few know beer die, some are fired up bout crud... somewhere along the line from O-1 to O-4 they start wearing panties... all AF O-4's are pretty much pole smokers.
The barkeeps don't even enforce the rules here. Being a bald, wrinkley eyed old LSO provides the aged look to kick the little fuckers out (I think they percieve me as an O-6 or something) who wear their caps in the bar and won't buy a round of cheer, but to be honest, the tradition is dying a horrible death. I see the steeley eyed killer in very few of the young grasshoppers, maybe I need to get my eyes checked again!
The barkeeps don't even enforce the rules here. Being a bald, wrinkley eyed old LSO provides the aged look to kick the little fuckers out (I think they percieve me as an O-6 or something) who wear their caps in the bar and won't buy a round of cheer, but to be honest, the tradition is dying a horrible death. I see the steeley eyed killer in very few of the young grasshoppers, maybe I need to get my eyes checked again!
"OPEN MESS" ... I wonder how many herein know what a "CLOSED MESS" is/was ... or have ever seen one ... ???
As a female, I definitely agree about restarting ladies' nights and advertising them to the general public. Every time I've been to the O'club here, either for lunch or for happy hour, I've been 1/1 or 1/2 females present. Women don't like sausage-fests either.
Also, the article is definitely right on finding the balance with drinkers and non-drinkers. I know some non-drinkers down here who do have fun going out to the bars, but for the most part, the people I know who don't drink don't go out because there's is a stigma attached to being a non-drinker (ie you're a dork). I drink and I honestly don't care if you do, so I think revitalizing the O'club would bring more camraderie as you bring all officers together to bond in their shared status, not as the non-drinker who is stuck at Seville taking care of his drunk buddies or even won't go out at all. Going out on the weekends can and I think even should involve alcohol to some extent, but if Navy leadership wants to deglamorize it, they should encourage outlets like the O'club where drinking is definitely involved, but not necessarily the main focus.
Also, the article is definitely right on finding the balance with drinkers and non-drinkers. I know some non-drinkers down here who do have fun going out to the bars, but for the most part, the people I know who don't drink don't go out because there's is a stigma attached to being a non-drinker (ie you're a dork). I drink and I honestly don't care if you do, so I think revitalizing the O'club would bring more camraderie as you bring all officers together to bond in their shared status, not as the non-drinker who is stuck at Seville taking care of his drunk buddies or even won't go out at all. Going out on the weekends can and I think even should involve alcohol to some extent, but if Navy leadership wants to deglamorize it, they should encourage outlets like the O'club where drinking is definitely involved, but not necessarily the main focus.
The only stigma attached to a non-drinker is DD. That's a great friend to have
I have no problem with people who don't drink. The ones that bother me are the ones that just don't do anything. Sorry, sitting in your house and reading on a friday night is near shameful if you're single and don't have a flight the next day.
I have no problem with people who don't drink. The ones that bother me are the ones that just don't do anything. Sorry, sitting in your house and reading on a friday night is near shameful if you're single and don't have a flight the next day.
Donno, from my time in Oceana, seems some females loved the sausage fest a little toooooo much. NFO training, a trip through the F-14 RAG, show up to a fleet squadron 2 weeks prior to cruise knocked up by a RAG instructor after a drunken night at the O-club... fleet CO made her stand in front of squadron and explain why she wouldn't be participating in deployment... but your point is well made, townies could only make it more fun.
CM, yer in a tough spot, (from my experience) make the 4ish out of 10 that carry their burden proud. Outfly, outdrink, outlead. Flame on.
I was tasked with help planning a wing Christmas party and cost per person was a big issue. I sat down with the O'club rep and was blown away by all the hidden cost. We were not allowed to clean up after ourselves, we could not use our own media. It was far far cheaper to do the party in town. On top of the long and annoying price sheet was an equally long list of rules. I also walked around and interviewed the staff, both civilian and military and they all agreed the O'club was not the place to go, based on there passed experiences with having parties at the club.
phrogpilot73
Well-Known Member
"Officers are big boys and girls and should be trusted as the adults they are."
He hit the nail on the head with one sentence.
He hit the nail on the head with one sentence.
How's the Norfolk O club doing these days for Happy Hour? It seems to me the place has turned into an all hands and civilian buffet lunch establishment.
The Jacksonville O-Club isn't even open anymore. Unless you book it for a special occasion, which really means it's no longer an O-Club.
Wow! That article reads so much like the discussion a few of the Wing and Squadron leaders had with the base MWR folks yesterday. I guess to most of the guys who know how things used to be, it isn't a big secret how to get them back that way. I agree it is up to the young officers to provide the main element of support, but we as leaders need to provide a place they want to gather and feel safe doing so - not a "one-stop-shopping" location for the base security Napoleons. We're trying, really.
MasterBates
Well-Known Member
Norfolk is basically an all-hands dining place now, the bar is open upon request and that's about it now a days. I'm working on planning another O-Club boozex, but I have been a bit busy lately.