NROTC vs. Academy

[DSL1990]

How do you know that? Maybe back in 1940 or so, but much less now, and in the Marines, not at all.

Besides, the OP was asking whether he should pursue a flight slot in the Marines from USNA or Marine-Option NROTC. A lot of posts here, esp the suggestion of BDCP, are missing this. If the OP has the intellect to get into a decent civilian school with NROTC, then he should. If after a year he still has a hard-on for the academy, he can still apply there. I have a suspicion he won't, though.

yep. just looked it up-
only 8 from OCS total. last 2 were:
Admiral Vernon E. Clark, former CNO- Navy OCS class of Aug 1968
Admiral Jeremy Michael Boorda, former CNO- Navy OCS class of Aug 1962

Out of 246 Admirals since there was even a US Navy, "220 were commissioned via the U.S. Naval Academy, 14 via Naval Reserve Officer Training Corps, 8 via Officer Candidate School, and 4 via other sources."

i think this makes my point in black and white!

OP: think long-term. pick NAPS+USNA if you have the choice!

 

[haubby]

So by your logic and seeing how you are going to VMI in the fall, the chances of you ever making Admiral (assuming you even graduate college) are not good at all. Maybe you should take a step back, rethink your words and remove your head from your a$$.

 

[BlackBearHockey]

i think this makes my point in black and white!

OP: think long-term. pick NAPS+USNA if you have the choice!

No, it makes you look retarded. First off, the OP wants to fly for the Marines, so I doubt he's trying to become an Admiral. Secondly, for you to try and prove your "point" by saying that the USNA is superior for career advancement because it has produced more Admirals since the INCEPTION of the Navy, you would need to overlook the fact that NROTC has only been around since 1926. I'm not a geologist but I would say that gives the USNA one or two years advantage... There are so many factors that would play into anything you're trying to prove that the blanket statement you just made makes you look like a ridiculously ignorant high school kid.

I really hope I can make it to O-3 one day, seeing as how I'm just an NROTC Mid and all, which is obviously a poor choice if one wants to advance in a Naval career....

 

[DSL1990]

So by your logic and seeing how you are going to VMI in the fall, the chances of you ever making Admiral (assuming you even graduate college) are not good at all. Maybe you should take a step back, rethink your words and remove your head from your a$$.

these are the statistics. and yes, i think my chances of making Admiral from VMI are not good at all. i may not like that, but that's what the statistics say.

not IMPOSSIBLE. you can see that 8 OCS grads also bucked the odds and made Admiral. But why make it hard on yourself, if you are accepted into the USNA system already?

if you want to argue, argue with the defense department that appointed 220 USNA grads to Admiral!

lol.

 

[BlackBearHockey]

yes, i think my chances of making Admiral from VMI are not good at all.

I would agree that I don't think you'll ever make Admiral, but for some reason it's not because of VMI.... don't you have a prom or something to get ready for?

 

[phrogdriver]

Not really, since he wants to be a Marine. Our current Commandant is a graduate of the highly esteemed Southeast Missouri State University. Before him, Generals Hagee and Krulak went to USNA, but Jones went to Georgetown, Mundy went to Auburn, and I don't think Gray even went to college!

Also, since there really was no NROTC until after WWII, the stats are going to be pretty skewed, even on the Navy side. There's also a self-selection bias in the results, since often those intending to stay in for the long term go to the academy to begin with, then 30 years later, you check up on them and say, "Wow, look how many stayed in and are successful." It doesn't mean there's causation, just correlation.

I think the reason the older guys here are saying to save the year at NAPS is because they already have commissions and see all the sources as producing products that vary wildly in quality. So, all things being equal, just go and get your commission the fastest way you can. All the routes end up the same--with a college degree and a commission.

Each commissioning source is suited to different individuals. I can't say that the academy will make candidate X the best officer. For him, NROTC might be best. Conversely, for another, USNA will be the better path. I like to think that's part of the reason we keep multiple commissioning sources around, even though the economics would say to just make one.

 

[whalepelt]

But why make it hard on yourself, if you are accepted into the USNA system already?

While ambition is wonderful, guess what? Your chances of getting 4 stars are negligible either way.

Furthermore, the person who decides how to act based on how it affects their chances of getting 4 stars is not someone I particularly want to serve around.

 

[DSL1990]

Secondly, for you to try and prove your "point" by saying that the USNA is superior for career advancement because it has produced more Admirals since the INCEPTION of the Navy, you would need to overlook the fact that NROTC has only been around since 1926. I'm not a geologist but I would say that gives the USNA one or two years advantage... There are so many factors that would play into anything you're trying to prove that the blanket statement you just made makes you look like a ridiculously ignorant high school kid.

no. it just makes me better at statistics then you.

ok. let's start counting only from the first NROTC-graduated Admiral, ADM Steven A White, NROTC 1952. He was appointed in 1983.
From 1983 until now, there have been 59 Admirals appointed. 40 from USNA, 14 from NROTC, 4 from OCS, 1 from other sources.

so even in the face of the existence of NROTC, 2/3rds of all Admirals from 1983 are USNA grads.

Now are you going to next argue that 2/3rds of the naval officers happen to be from USNA making this statistic worthless? lol.

 

[DSL1990]

I would agree that I don't think you'll ever make Admiral, but for some reason it's not because of VMI.... don't you have a prom or something to get ready for?

was that the 1st sexist innuendo in this thread? forgive me if you are referring to something else, but yes, i am female and that makes my chances of making O-10 even lower than yours.

 

[phrogdriver]

was that the 1st sexist innuendo in this thread? forgive me if you are referring to something else, but yes, i am female and that makes my chances of making O-10 even lower than yours.

Being a female won't hurt your chances of making flag...might even help. I think he was talking about your attitude.

 

[DSL1990]

While ambition is wonderful, guess what? Your chances of getting 4 stars are negligible either way.

Furthermore, the person who decides how to act based on how it affects their chances of getting 4 stars is not someone I particularly want to serve around.

and i think you're naive if you think that this statistic on O-10's doesn't reflect a deeper bias in the navy towards USNA grads.

(i can't believe that a highschooler is having to wake you older guys up. we don't live in a makebelieve land. the us navy is biased towards USNA grads. who can doubt this? or maybe it's just that because USNA grads are so dug in there at the top that USNA grads are biased towards other USNA grads. but either way, it's true. just look at the statistics.)

 

[DSL1990]

Being a female won't hurt your chances of making flag...might even help. I think he was talking about your attitude.

ok. sry. i take that back.

btw, there have been zero women who have made O-10 in the Navy, so i don't think being female helps you to become a flag officer.

 

[DSL1990]

btw, i do believe that wherever you end up, you have to be proud of the place you went to school. should i be honored enough to graduate from VMI, am i going to hide my diploma? no way! 265 general and flag officers came out of VMI.

i'm just address the original poster. i just don't think it's rational to have a straight shot at USNA through NAPS and turn it down because it's going to take ONE MORE YEAR.

because that is what this argument boils down to. would every one who wants the OP to take NROTC be arguing as hard if he had said he had gotten a direct appointment to USNA but was trying to decide between USNA and NROTC? it comes down to the PRICE of that extra year (NAPS). I just think that that 1 year is worth less than the price of not going to USNA.

 

[bunk22]

(i can't believe that a highschooler is having to wake you older guys up. we don't live in a makebelieve land. the us navy is biased towards USNA grads. who can doubt this? or maybe it's just that because USNA grads are so dug in there at the top that USNA grads are biased towards other USNA grads. but either way, it's true. just look at the statistics.)

I can't believe a high schooler thinks she knows anything about anything Navy. I recommend treading lightly.

 

[DSL1990]

don't you have a prom or something to get ready for?

the prom is not until may 30th! wheee!