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Gun tape vs gun 'camera' tape

E

Easton

New Member
Not being familiar with terminology used by pilots and other Naval aviators, I'd like to know what exactly is meant by a "gun tape"? (To be more specific, this would be the 'gun tape' found typically in an F/A-18 E or F aircraft. )

I've thought it must be shorthand for 'gun camera tape', but what I've been able to find has me wondering if those may be completely different things. I get the impression that it's some kind of recording tape but that it doesn't require a gun actually being fired for this tape to be recording whatever it records.

So my question is: what does a 'gun tape' show? In particular, does it record any kind of video imagery or just information from other onboard instruments? And who typically would be responsible for turning it on (the pilot or WSO?), and what would be a typical scenario that would result in a 'gun tape'.

Thanks!
 
Easton said:
Not being familiar with terminology used by pilots and other Naval aviators, I'd like to know what exactly is meant by a "gun tape"? (To be more specific, this would be the 'gun tape' found typically in an F/A-18 E or F aircraft. )

I've thought it must be shorthand for 'gun camera tape', but what I've been able to find has me wondering if those may be completely different things. I get the impression that it's some kind of recording tape but that it doesn't require a gun actually being fired for this tape to be recording whatever it records.

So my question is: what does a 'gun tape' show? In particular, does it record any kind of video imagery or just information from other onboard instruments? And who typically would be responsible for turning it on (the pilot or WSO?), and what would be a typical scenario that would result in a 'gun tape'.

Thanks!
Click to expand...
In all the high lot Rhinos and Growlers, your DDI displays and HUD camera (the view as though you were looking through the HUD and beyond to what is on the nose), radios and ICS are all digitally recorded. This is mostly used for debrief purposes where you can replay the flight, listen to the comms, and see what the jet's displays were showing the crew. All of your flight parameters are recorded, so you can see a 3D view of what your aircraft (and others) are doing. It's a great tool to maximize the effectiveness of the debrief. If you do something dumb, like draw a Sky Dong with your contrails, your CO and his boss are going to want to look at your tapes to confirm whether or not you did that dumb thing. Blessing and a curse.

So, these days, when you hear "tapes on, fights on" it is telling everyone in the flight that your recording switches are all set up, and the briefed engagement is beginning.
 
Thanks for the reply. To be sure I understand correctly -- if all that data is being recorded when it's "tapes on..", and you mentioned the HUD camera as recording the view looking through the HUD and out toward the nose, does that mean the the HUD camera is basically recording video of whatever is out in front of the nose?
For example, in a dogfight with an F/A-18 chasing another jet, when a 'gun tape' is recording all you described, does that mean there should also be some video footage showing the view of the other jet out in front (something akin to what we see in the movies when we see a pilots view of the jet he's chasing. :)

I'm just trying be sure on that point... whether what's called a 'gun tape' records both instrument data as well as raw video images of what's happening.
Thanks again!!
 
Easton said:
Thanks for the reply. To be sure I understand correctly -- if all that data is being recorded when it's "tapes on..", and you mentioned the HUD camera as recording the view looking through the HUD and out toward the nose, does that mean the the HUD camera is basically recording video of whatever is out in front of the nose?
For example, in a dogfight with an F/A-18 chasing another jet, when a 'gun tape' is recording all you described, does that mean there should also be some video footage showing the view of the other jet out in front (something akin to what we see in the movies when we see a pilots view of the jet he's chasing. :)

I'm just trying be sure on that point... whether what's called a 'gun tape' records both instrument data as well as raw video images of what's happening.
Thanks again!!
Click to expand...
The term "gun tape" is an anachronism, but essentially yes. We just call them "tapes." The below video shows an older example. More modern HUD video is color, but it still isn't great quality. It's a fairly narrow field of view, so you're really only seeing what is directly in front of the jet.

 
Wow, that's an exciting video to watch, and to hear his description of how it all went down (no pun intended :)

Since it's clear from all you've said that the HUD camera does capture video along with everything else, let me narrow the next few questions to refer specifically to the Navy F/A-18F 'Super Hornet" with the pilot in front, WSO in back. From what I've read, it seems that an ATFLIR would be the most advanced camera/targeting system -if- one was mounted in place at the time.

Q1) But, if I understand correctly, then even if there was not an ATFLIR installed, and even if the pilot did not turn on his 'helmet camera', the HUD camera would still record quite a lot of video and data?

Q2) In a potential intercept situation, when the pilot isn't yet sure who or what he's intercepting, would would normally be responsible for turning on the HUD camera (and/or any other cameras/systems on board)... the pilot, or the WSO?

Thanks for letting me pick your brain. This is helping a lot with a story I've been working on!
 
Caveat: I've never used ATFILR, but among targeting pods, most folks say that it is terrible. Targeting pods are a whole other ball of wax, so I wouldn't ump them in with HUD tapes, etc.

In Growler (and presumably in Rhino) Pilots are responsible for the switchology that controls what gets recorded. These are almost always set according to a pre-briefed plan. Stuff is always being recorded in flight, so it's not like you turn it on right before an intercept. Probably something you'll double check during your fence in and fence out checks.
 
Okay...after several days of studying up on what does what, I think it's correct to say that what is called the 'gun camera' in an F/A-18F is essentially part of the CVRS system as a whole. Correct me if I've missed something important.

Now to get rather specific... I need to know, with as high degree of certainty as possible, whether the CVRS/gun camera system would be turned on in a situation like the following example:
Imagine an F/A-18 pilot cruising along with nothing urgent happening, and presumably with the CVRS system turned off. But then he suddenly receives orders to go check out an unknown target, and ultimately he spots the target far below near the surface. Would you expect an experienced fighter pilot to switch on the CVRS system under these circumstances?

(For arguments sake, also imagine the aircraft had no 'load-out', no on-board weapons). But then the pilot decides to descend toward and even try to close on the target? Is turning on the CVRS completely arbitrary in situations like this, or would a long-time professional Navy fighter pilot flip on the CVRS system practically by habit? I'm mainly trying to understand if there's any justifiable reason to -not- have turned on the CVRS system when you aren't sure what you're approaching.

Thanks again...
 
Easton said:
Okay...after several days of studying up on what does what, I think it's correct to say that what is called the 'gun camera' in an F/A-18F is essentially part of the CVRS system as a whole. Correct me if I've missed something important.

Now to get rather specific... I need to know, with as high degree of certainty as possible, whether the CVRS/gun camera system would be turned on in a situation like the following example:
Imagine an F/A-18 pilot cruising along with nothing urgent happening, and presumably with the CVRS system turned off. But then he suddenly receives orders to go check out an unknown target, and ultimately he spots the target far below near the surface. Would you expect an experienced fighter pilot to switch on the CVRS system under these circumstances?

(For arguments sake, also imagine the aircraft had no 'load-out', no on-board weapons). But then the pilot decides to descend toward and even try to close on the target? Is turning on the CVRS completely arbitrary in situations like this, or would a long-time professional Navy fighter pilot flip on the CVRS system practically by habit? I'm mainly trying to understand if there's any justifiable reason to -not- have turned on the CVRS system when you aren't sure what you're approaching.

Thanks again...
Click to expand...
That’s correct, it is the CVRS system. In the scenario you described, the pilot should theoretically conduct his “fence-in” checks to make sure all of his combat systems are appropriately set up before intercepting the unknown aircraft, although it will be dependent on the oparea and overall associated risk (e.g. probably not as high of a priority checking out an aircraft off the west coast while on a training exercise).

I think you’re laser focusing on something that isn’t ultimately very important to be honest. Like Brett said, the system is always recording something based on a pre-briefed setup/startup procedures, so the only change (if any) would be to switch which display is being recorded. It’s one among multiple things that is done when fencing in, but it’d be lower on the priority list then making sure the radar is properly set up, you’re on the right radio frequencies, expendables are set up, etc.

In the scenario you described with no weapons, the priority would be to vector in an aircraft that has the proper loadout if one was available if there could be a potential threat.

There really isn’t a reason to ever not record things that I can think of.
 
@Easton We understand you are a writer and may be writing a book/novel/story about the subject. So, why are you asking the specific question? Maybe a little more background or what scenario you are trying to tell, and maybe we could help with why a recording did or did not happen.
 
BarryD said:
I honestly was totally unaware that pilots always owned the tapes in the Growler
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We also have switches in back, but stan is for pilots to manage. I assumed that was just borrowed from the SF folks. CRM generally had pilots focus more on A/A stuff while the EWO focused on ES and EA.
 
cfam said:
I think you’re laser focusing on something that isn’t ultimately very important to be honest.
Click to expand...
This. Whatever the OP is writing, anchoring on switchology is something that 99.99% of potential readers will know nothing about, and frankly find boring.

@Easton appreciate your desire for accuracy, but extreme accuracy in fiction writing can get in the way of storytelling. Better to create drama in your story than get the switchology 100% right.

You’re the writer. Make some cool shit up.
 
Brett327 said:
We also have switches in back, but stan is for pilots to manage. I assumed that was just borrowed from the SF folks. CRM generally had pilots focus more on A/A stuff while the EWO focused on ES and EA.
Click to expand...
I’m sure it’s changed by now, but I remember taking at least one tape on some flights, especially when we went through that phase of validating jamming line by line. It was easier than trying to get us both on the same screen simultaneously.
 
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