Future USS Doris Miller (CVN 81)

[123412131]

That cat (preemptive pardons) is a few years out of the bag. Besides, I don’t think Trump’s brain works like that.

He's probably aware, he just doesn't particularly care. The problem is that there are many in the administration who do care, because they either aren't going to be pardoned or the pardon won't be sufficient protection from some of the other consequences. Junior staffers, Hegseth's personnel at the Pentagon, anybody with any interest in working in a democratic-run state afterward. Political retribution is inevitable; you're not getting elected as a Democrat unless you campaign on it. It will just primarily involve salting the earth on everything related to this administration while the figureheads remain untouched. I doubt he ever leaves Florida once he's out of office, and I can't see the state AG taking much interest in lawfare against him.

 

[Brett327]

With reference to investigating and protecting Trump, it’s fairly obvious he is going to pull a Biden and issue blanket pardons to everyone involved in his administration. There will, of course, be fruitless and wasteful “investigations” just like the Fauci clown show, but that’s political theater for the base.

I'm envisioning a scope much broader than admin members. Yes, there will be mass pardons, but not everyone will earn one. Many states have criminal and civil statutes governing insider trading, bribery, fraud, tax evasion, for example. I think we'll probably see cases challenging the validity of a pardon when the elements of bribery or quid pro quo can be demonstrated - though I have zero confidence that SCOTUS will do the right thing with such a case.

 

[Brett327]

I doubt he ever leaves Florida once he's out of office

The State, County and City of New York has joined the chat.

 

[Griz882]

I'm envisioning a scope much broader than admin members. Yes, there will be mass pardons, but not everyone will earn one. Many states have criminal and civil statutes governing insider trading, bribery, fraud, tax evasion, for example. I think we'll probably see cases challenging the validity of a pardon when the elements of bribery or quid pro quo can be demonstrated - though I have zero confidence that SCOTUS will do the right thing with such a case.

I get it, but this will only open interstate legal warfare against politicians. If Texas feels harmed by some DSC member…a court case…maybe jail time. New York, sure, they’ll spend billions to hound Trump to his grave, and it will all be wasted ending with anger, distrust and even more partisan division. History will judge Trump harshly enough. I’d be happy to let him off the hook to prevent a daughter or son taking up the mantle and promises of revenge justice that could very well get them elected. The cycle needs to stop.

 

[Brett327]

I get it, but this will only open interstate legal warfare against politicians. If Texas feels harmed by some DSC member…a court case…maybe jail time. New York, sure, they’ll spend billions to hound Trump to his grave, and it will all be wasted ending with anger, distrust and even more partisan division. History will judge Trump harshly enough. I’d be happy to let him off the hook to prevent a daughter or son taking up the mantle and promises of revenge justice that could very well get them elected. The cycle needs to stop.

As I said, I'm not concerned with Trump himself. He'll be in the grave before any chance at accountability could play out. It's the rest of the little profiteers that need to answer to their crimes. The problem with saying that the cycle needs to stop is that it won't until people feel real consequences for law breaking. If the next sane administration just throws their hands up and does nothing, the same MAGA crowd - or whatever they morph into - will do it again and again when "their side" is in power. You have it backwards. The cycle stops when there's a real disincentive to committing crime. Being adjacent to politics cannot be the basis for immunity to consequence. That's a colossal moral hazard.

 

[Griz882]

As I said, I'm not concerned with Trump himself. He'll be in the grave before any chance at accountability could play out. It's the rest of the little profiteers that need to answer to their crimes. The problem with saying that the cycle needs to stop is that it won't until people feel real consequences for law breaking. If the next sane administration just throws their hands up and does nothing, the same MAGA crowd - or whatever they morph into - will do it again and again when "their side" is in power. You have it backwards. The cycle stops when there's a real disincentive to committing crime. Being adjacent to politics cannot be the basis for immunity to consequence. That's a colossal moral hazard.

I don’t necessarily disagree and I too would prefer to veer toward real justice. I just believe we need to be careful not to make it appear like a witch hunt.