They did when I brought a T-38 there.
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World's 14 Best Aviation Museums
- Thread starter xj220
- Start date
Was invited to a promotion ceremony today at the Marine Corps Museum in Quantico. Was blown away by the quality and depth of the displays. Lots of Aviation displays . . . . . the Devil Dogs did a really nice job with this one. If you’re in the area, it’s definitely worth your time.
This summer me, my father in law, and my brother in law did a European guys trip. We flew from BOS to AMS and then rented a car to drive down the coast to France via Belgium. We spent a day in Brussels, two days in Ypres, and two days in Normandy.
Brussels
-we picked brussels as a midpoint between AMS and Ypres to get our road trip startef after a day of flying if you find yourself in Brussels I highly recommend you take a few hours to go to the Royal Museum of the Armed Forces and Military History. We went expecting to see a few planes and found a museum full of mitaria that goes back to the middle ages. In addition the museum has a large collection of WWI pieces, many of which were left behind by retreating Germans in 1918. The WWI collection included early armor such as a MkIV. They also have an aviation exhibit that has a decent collection of Belgian focused aircraft. Oh, and lots of ridiculous hats from the Napoleonic era.
Ypres
-very cool city that looks old but was actually completely rebuilt less than a hundred years ago after it was literally shelled flat during four years of fighting in the Ypres Salient. Ypres felt a lot like the British version of Gettysburg to me. Lots of Brits and Commonwealth folks travel to Ypres to follow a family members war diary or to find a name on the Mennin Gate. The Mennin Gate is the site of a nightly Last Post service in memory of the fallen; the service has occurred every night since 1928 except during WWII when it was conducted in Britian. We went to the amazing museum in the gothic Cloth Hall to situate ourselves with an overview of the history The next day we took a tour of the Salient from a great local guide. The tour covered historical sites such as Essex Farm where "In Flanders Fields" was written, a German war grave, the Canadian memorial at St Julient that was the site of one of the first gas attacks, tyn cot cemetery, and Hill 62 battlefield with it's trenches. We we're seen as oddities in town because although they get a lot of tourists very few are Americans. NY Times recently had an article on visiting Ypres:
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/28/travel/the-52-places-traveler-ypres.html
Vimy Ridge
-the Canadian memorial was a short detour off of route between Ypres and Cabourg that was well worth the stop. The Canucks did it right with their memorial. There's a small visitor center that is staffed by a small group of Canadian college students who go through a highly competitive process to get a spot at vimy Ridge. All of the guides were very well spoken and eager to share the history of the site, they greet you upon entry (in French at first) and ask what brings you to vimy Ridge. Once again folks were surprised to have Americans visiting. They made a few jokes about us getting rowdy on the tour and then, in keeping with stereotypes, said "sorry." The tour covered the tunnels that were used during the assault and the remaining trench systems as well as a good history of the strategic, operational, and tactical levels of the battle. From the visitor center it was a short walk up a hill to the memorial site. The memorial is spectacular. The ground on the way up to the memorial looks like a moonscape from the shell craters that still exist a hundred years later.
Normandy
-stayed at a nice beach hotel in Cabourg that was close to Pegasus bridge. We went to the American cemetery at Omaha and then to the overlord museum. From they were drove down to the vierville draw to Charlie sector Dog Green beach. This was the beach that was portrayed in Saving Private Ryan. Some bunkers and pieces of a Mulberry harbor are still there. Tide was up so it was hard to get a sense of the distance from low tide to the shingle. Also stopped at Point Du Hoc where the Rangers scaled the cliffs to assault the artillery pieces that were supposed to be there. The battlefield is filled with huge craters from naval gunfire and German bunkers.
from there back to AMS and BOS. Very interesting, poignant, and moving trip. Highly recommend the trip, especially Ypres and the tour and the Vimy Ridge memorial. It's a shame that we as Americans don't have a similar setup as the Canucks do at Vimy with young Americans sharing our history.
Brussels
-we picked brussels as a midpoint between AMS and Ypres to get our road trip startef after a day of flying if you find yourself in Brussels I highly recommend you take a few hours to go to the Royal Museum of the Armed Forces and Military History. We went expecting to see a few planes and found a museum full of mitaria that goes back to the middle ages. In addition the museum has a large collection of WWI pieces, many of which were left behind by retreating Germans in 1918. The WWI collection included early armor such as a MkIV. They also have an aviation exhibit that has a decent collection of Belgian focused aircraft. Oh, and lots of ridiculous hats from the Napoleonic era.
Ypres
-very cool city that looks old but was actually completely rebuilt less than a hundred years ago after it was literally shelled flat during four years of fighting in the Ypres Salient. Ypres felt a lot like the British version of Gettysburg to me. Lots of Brits and Commonwealth folks travel to Ypres to follow a family members war diary or to find a name on the Mennin Gate. The Mennin Gate is the site of a nightly Last Post service in memory of the fallen; the service has occurred every night since 1928 except during WWII when it was conducted in Britian. We went to the amazing museum in the gothic Cloth Hall to situate ourselves with an overview of the history The next day we took a tour of the Salient from a great local guide. The tour covered historical sites such as Essex Farm where "In Flanders Fields" was written, a German war grave, the Canadian memorial at St Julient that was the site of one of the first gas attacks, tyn cot cemetery, and Hill 62 battlefield with it's trenches. We we're seen as oddities in town because although they get a lot of tourists very few are Americans. NY Times recently had an article on visiting Ypres:
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/28/travel/the-52-places-traveler-ypres.html
Vimy Ridge
-the Canadian memorial was a short detour off of route between Ypres and Cabourg that was well worth the stop. The Canucks did it right with their memorial. There's a small visitor center that is staffed by a small group of Canadian college students who go through a highly competitive process to get a spot at vimy Ridge. All of the guides were very well spoken and eager to share the history of the site, they greet you upon entry (in French at first) and ask what brings you to vimy Ridge. Once again folks were surprised to have Americans visiting. They made a few jokes about us getting rowdy on the tour and then, in keeping with stereotypes, said "sorry." The tour covered the tunnels that were used during the assault and the remaining trench systems as well as a good history of the strategic, operational, and tactical levels of the battle. From the visitor center it was a short walk up a hill to the memorial site. The memorial is spectacular. The ground on the way up to the memorial looks like a moonscape from the shell craters that still exist a hundred years later.
Normandy
-stayed at a nice beach hotel in Cabourg that was close to Pegasus bridge. We went to the American cemetery at Omaha and then to the overlord museum. From they were drove down to the vierville draw to Charlie sector Dog Green beach. This was the beach that was portrayed in Saving Private Ryan. Some bunkers and pieces of a Mulberry harbor are still there. Tide was up so it was hard to get a sense of the distance from low tide to the shingle. Also stopped at Point Du Hoc where the Rangers scaled the cliffs to assault the artillery pieces that were supposed to be there. The battlefield is filled with huge craters from naval gunfire and German bunkers.
from there back to AMS and BOS. Very interesting, poignant, and moving trip. Highly recommend the trip, especially Ypres and the tour and the Vimy Ridge memorial. It's a shame that we as Americans don't have a similar setup as the Canucks do at Vimy with young Americans sharing our history.
Attachments
Bit of a threadjack, but cemeteries are something like museums. I became fascinated by overseas war cemeteries several years ago after stumbling across a Commonwealth War Cemetery in Bavaria. The Commonwealth War Graves Commission care for war cemeteries in over 150 countries! Obviously a legacy of the Empire that reigned for hundreds of years. In contrast, the American Battle Monuments Commission (not the VA) maintains cemeteries in just 24 countries with most graves, obviously, in Europe, but also Mexico City, Panama, and the PI.
Like Pags and many of you, I have visited Normandy and the cemetary above Omaha beach. It stands in stark contrst to the German cemetary at La Cambe, where their dead from the Normandy battle are buried. Twenty One Thousand of them. Just 9387 Americans are buried at Normandy. Many were shipped home. Most of the Germans were not. Interestingly, many Americans were initially buried at La Cambe during and immediately after the battle. But they were located to the site above Omaha or shipped home, leaving La Cambe for the Germans, which the American Graves Registry teams dutifully cataloged.
La Cambe is stark and brooding. The visitor center is all about peace and the tragedy of war and post war efforts to avoid another war like the two World Wars. Unlike Normandy, there are no stories of sacrifice or heroism, or just cause. La Cambe is nominally operated by the German War Commission. But unlike their Commonwealth and American counterparts, they get no government funding. The effort is funded by donations and volunteer labor. La Cambe is maintained by volunteer Frenchmen, including school children. When I stumbled across the Commonwealth Durnbach Cemetery in Bavaria, the groundskeeper was there tending the landscape. He was a Brit, employed by the UK government, living in Germany. Likewise, there are plenty of Americans employed at Normandy. No Germans at their military cemetery.
Interesting about Durnbach, it is almost all Commonwealth aviators shot down over Germany and Austria. Many of the others were POWs who escaped local camps and were executed or shot in the attempt. The groundskeeper made a point of showing us the graves of a couple Americans. One was a volunteer through Canada before the US got involved, the other a non-aviator who stowed away on a Lancaster so he could see some action. There was a fresh grave. A vet who had just died. He wanted to be buried along side his crewmates who didn't survive the shoot down. The UK paid for his remains to be shipped to Durnbach and for his family to travel for the grave side service. This was a family trip through Bavaria. Durnbach is just off a tiny two lane road in the middle of nowhere. I felt blessed we found it and my young kids to experience it. No crowds, just us and a man who was intimate with the place, in beautiful summer time Bavaria.
Normandy. All the Medal of Honor recipients have gold lettering.
La Cambe German cemetery outside Bayeux Normandy.
Durnbach Commonwealth Cemetery in Bavaria. Very much on the style of all US military cemeteries.
Like Pags and many of you, I have visited Normandy and the cemetary above Omaha beach. It stands in stark contrst to the German cemetary at La Cambe, where their dead from the Normandy battle are buried. Twenty One Thousand of them. Just 9387 Americans are buried at Normandy. Many were shipped home. Most of the Germans were not. Interestingly, many Americans were initially buried at La Cambe during and immediately after the battle. But they were located to the site above Omaha or shipped home, leaving La Cambe for the Germans, which the American Graves Registry teams dutifully cataloged.
La Cambe is stark and brooding. The visitor center is all about peace and the tragedy of war and post war efforts to avoid another war like the two World Wars. Unlike Normandy, there are no stories of sacrifice or heroism, or just cause. La Cambe is nominally operated by the German War Commission. But unlike their Commonwealth and American counterparts, they get no government funding. The effort is funded by donations and volunteer labor. La Cambe is maintained by volunteer Frenchmen, including school children. When I stumbled across the Commonwealth Durnbach Cemetery in Bavaria, the groundskeeper was there tending the landscape. He was a Brit, employed by the UK government, living in Germany. Likewise, there are plenty of Americans employed at Normandy. No Germans at their military cemetery.
Interesting about Durnbach, it is almost all Commonwealth aviators shot down over Germany and Austria. Many of the others were POWs who escaped local camps and were executed or shot in the attempt. The groundskeeper made a point of showing us the graves of a couple Americans. One was a volunteer through Canada before the US got involved, the other a non-aviator who stowed away on a Lancaster so he could see some action. There was a fresh grave. A vet who had just died. He wanted to be buried along side his crewmates who didn't survive the shoot down. The UK paid for his remains to be shipped to Durnbach and for his family to travel for the grave side service. This was a family trip through Bavaria. Durnbach is just off a tiny two lane road in the middle of nowhere. I felt blessed we found it and my young kids to experience it. No crowds, just us and a man who was intimate with the place, in beautiful summer time Bavaria.
Normandy. All the Medal of Honor recipients have gold lettering.
La Cambe German cemetery outside Bayeux Normandy.
Durnbach Commonwealth Cemetery in Bavaria. Very much on the style of all US military cemeteries.
Happy to continue the threadjack
Our tour of the Ypres Salient visisted several grave sites and the guide highlighted the differences between the British, French, and German cemetaries. The CWGC left many of the British fallen where they were buried following the various battles and because of this there are CWGC cemetaries scattered all over the landscape outside of Ypres. All of them have a consistent theme and include a memorial cross and a memorial non-denominational "altar." In many cases the CWGC cemetaries appear to be disjointed with tombstones pointing in different directions and with different spacing but this is intentional. The directionality of the stone reflects how the dead were originally buried and because many of these cemetaries were near battle sites or dressing stations the dead were buried haphazardly and in some cases when the dressing stations were close to the front line and artillery strikes on the grave sites required the dead to be reburied, in some cases years after their initial burial. The proximity of tombstones is also by design and reflects that the markers are for a "mass grave." For instance, the Essex Farm cemetary had eight tombstones next to each other; the story went that eight soldiers were in a group when a large shell blew them all to pieces. After the attack no one could tell whose piece was whose so all the remains were put into one grave and eight tombstones were installed with the names of the fallen.
As Wink mentions the German War Graves aren't supported by the government and are more akin to a mass burial. The Langemark German Cemetary looks very similar to the one Wink discusses above and while it has some standalone markers the vast majority of the fallen are interred in a mass grave that contains almost ~30k.
On our tour the group discussed how in looking at cemetaries it becomes apparent how each country/culture values the sacrifices of their war dead and the memory of that particular conflict. The guide said a lot of nice words about how well the CWGC takes care of the cemetaries when a Kiwi on the tour said, "these CWGC cemetaries may be nice, but you should see the American cemetaries! They're immaculate and look like a park." Omaha certainly fit with his description.
D
Deleted member 67144 scul
Guest
No USS Midway on the list? For shame.
space_sailor
Well-Known Member
FYI,
The NNAM in Pensacola is open to the public again!
If you are a civilian you need either a Real ID, or your passport, or two forms of government ID.
Enter through the west gate of NASP.
This also means that the Blue Angels practices are open to the public as well!
The NNAM in Pensacola is open to the public again!
If you are a civilian you need either a Real ID, or your passport, or two forms of government ID.
Enter through the west gate of NASP.
This also means that the Blue Angels practices are open to the public as well!
GroundPounder
Well-Known Member
The Imperial War Museum in Duxford, England is worth a trip. They have a large selection of aircraft, to include military and civilian. In addition, they have a military vehicle section as well.
We took the kids to Duxford years ago. Just happened to be not just a flying weekend, which are common, but a full on recreation of base operations from WW II. They had re-enactors all throughout the field. Even a scramble to fighters. Totally awesome. Something like Old Reinbeck but with WW II aircraft.
If you're in England, then make the effort to get to the RAF Museum in Hendon, on the outskirts of London. It's been 30 years since I was there, but it was good. They have a Kestrel... the early version of the Harrier and only 9 were built.
I recall you could get to it via Underground, and then a 10 minute walk.
VMO4
Well-Known Member
Many of my favorites have been mentioned, such as Hendon, another Normandy area museum is the D-Day exhibit at Arromanches-Les-bains. In addition to a fantastic explanation of how that area was the gas station of the invasion, but the museum has a display of every allied soldier who landed at the beaches, something like over 30 countries. Very well done.
GroundPounder
Well-Known Member
I'm going back to Scotland at the end of the summer, I was on the fence about a direct flight to EDI or connecting in London. I guess I will have to go through LGW or LHR and check it out.
There used to be one at Wright Pat, don't know if they still have it.