Wanting aviation but selected for submarines / nuke

[Elizabeth Jagoe]

I've heard of a lot of NROTC and Academy Midshipmen with stellar grades, especially in Calculus and Physics, have Aviation as their top choice but can often be selected for Submarines instead. I think the Submarine force is great, but I want to be a pilot. How can I avoid this?

 

[BigBadBoJenkins]

All you can do is try your best, and cross your fingers.

Or maybe check to see the required classes for subs/nukes and pilot, and see if you can get all the pilot requirements without getting all the sub/nuke requirements. I haven't heard of this happening to any mids that I know.

 

[Renegade One]

I've heard of a lot of NROTC and Academy Midshipmen with stellar grades, especially in Calculus and Physics, have Aviation as their top choice but can often be selected for Submarines instead. I think the Submarine force is great, but I want to be a pilot. How can I avoid this?

EJ: I'll be interested in watching this. I have no idea how that part of the process works, but have always been interested. Clearly (I think), the NUCPOWER community has some sort of "first suck" from the frothy top level of the smart guys and gals. In a way, it's a compliment...you obviously did very well. I understand your "Yeah, but..." situation. I hope some smarter (more current with the process) folks wade in and give you advice on how to go where you want to go. Best of luck. We'd be lucky to have you in Navy Air...

 

[insanebikerboy]

From an Academy perspective, you can be made to go to the NUPOC interview but they can't force you to pass it. Just saying.

 

[Renegade One]

From an Academy perspective, you can be made to go to the NUPOC interview but they can't force you to pass it. Just saying.

But is there any "you must be a volunteer" for NUPOC aspect, or if you are qualified/invited/pass the interview...that's it?

 

[IKE]

Your profile says you're a 3/C MIDN, so I'm going to say:

1) Way to think ahead, but

2) Concentrate on school now, see what you get on the ASTB, and worry about this again during the summer between your 2/C and 1/C years (or 1/C fall semester).

Is the sub force taking female nukes yet or just female suppos? I could see you getting yanked to sub nuke if you're one of a few qualified females (can anyone confirm if this happened to female SWO wannabes when aviation was integrated? - that could be a good indicator.)

 

[insanebikerboy]

But is there any "you must be a volunteer" for NUPOC aspect, or if you are qualified/invited/pass the interview...that's it?

Only on paper. I knew guys of the engineering flavor that were really smart that were told to go to the interview. Once there they didn't fair so well. Whether they sucked or had selective forgetfulness is debateable, but either way they didn't have a say in at least going to the interview.

 

[scoober78]

From an Academy perspective, you can be made to go to the NUPOC interview but they can't force you to pass it. Just saying.

No, they can't force you to pass it, but, there can be ramifications if it's clear that you didn't pass it on purpose. By ramifications I mean, SWO. I would make it clear, to the Admiral if it goes that far, that this is not the career path you desire but the wise don't fail on purpose. The only HOPE you have of controlling your destiny in this career is your performance. If it's good, you might get what you want...if it isn't it's truly a roll of the dice.

 

[e6bflyer]

The sub force is proudly all volunteer. If you go to the interview and make it known that you do not desire to be part of their elite force, you will not be forced into that direction. That, however, will not stop them from drafting you into the surface Navy. I have never been through the interview process, but I cannot imagine that they would put your folder on the top of the stack if you have no desire to be part of their program and let that be known.
All of the above is speculation except the whole volunteer thing.

 

[BUDU]

Is the sub force taking female nukes yet or just female suppos?

We had a female sub-nuke in my OCS class. One of the very first. Obviously I can't speak for Academy or ROTC selection though.

 

[Aquonox]

For my class (USNA 2012), it seemed like there was more interest in submarines this year than in the past. I didn't hear of a ton of cases where aviation wannabees were forced to go submarines. I did see quite a few cases of people wanting to go SWO who were made to go to a nuke interview and became Nuke SWOs. In my company, everyone save like 2 people got their first choice (i.e. about 35 out of 37 people got their #1 choice). And those guys that didn't get their first choice had nothing to do with aviation.

In my situation I put NFO as my first choice and subs was my 3rd choice. Although I was near the top of my class and was an engineering major, I wasn't even considered for a nuke interview due to the fact that few people select NFO out of the Academy. A more common situation you will see (well, at USNA anyways; I'm not sure about NROTC) is people who are made NFOs because there aren't enough pilot slots and barely anyone puts NFO as #1.

If you do get selected for a Nuke interview, my advice would be to do your best and simply tell the admiral that you would like to go aviation and why. Don't bash on the sub community (he's a 4 star nuke admiral after all!), but try to convince him that the Navy would be better served with you in the pilots seat. Letting him know that you were a part of a flying club, or have met with other aviators would probably help. I know a few guys at the academy that were able to convince our Commandant to let them fly and not even get a nuke interview. I'm not sure how different the selection process is for NROTC.

I see that you are a third class midshipman right now. I wouldn't worry about selection at this point. Just do your best in school and learn all that you can during summer cruise, CORTRAMID, etc. I can't tell you how many people were interested in doing one thing for the first 2-3 years at USNA only to find out what they really liked was something else (usually PROTRAMID/CORTRAMID got people interested in a certain community).

Good luck with your endeavors!

 

[Yardstick]

If you end up going to the interview, tact is key with the Admiral. Just like Aquonox said, do your best and be humble in your reasoning. There were a few guys from my rotc unit that did exactly this at the interview which they were forced to go to, and the Admiral was nice enough to let them go back to aviation. I would also advise against purposefully bombing the interview, as that would only serve to piss everyone off. The bottom line is to do your best at the interview and be respectful with the Admiral if you get to that point.

 

[Spekkio]

If the academy or your NROTC unit doesn't meet their yearly quota for nuke, your OIC will pick midshipmen to go to the interviews.

The "ramifications" are somewhat overblown. As far as I know, Naval Reactors is not going to call your unit and make you a SWO to "punish" you. The SWO community doesn't benefit from having people who really don't want to be there anymore than the sub community. He may give a shit-o-gram to your OIC on why he wasted Navy dollars sending a candidate who doesn't have the aptititude to pass the tech interviews or is adamently opposed to being a nuke, but it's your career not his (as a sidenote, you should communicate how dead-set you are against being a nuke to your OIC to possibly avoid this entirely). Naval Reactors may also turn around and say that he doesn't care you don't want to go nuke, welcome to being a submariner. There are people who have failed/declined at the interview and have still selected aviation...there are even some of those people on these forums. If you really, really don't want to be a nuke, just think of it this way: being a SWO with fresh air and sunlight is better than being a submariner smelling like amine and standing 3-section duty.

Bottom line is do your best and be honest.

 

[exNavyOffRec]

If you are a tech major they will look at all your tech classes, you could have stellar grades in Calc and Physics but if you have some borderline grades you may not screen, the screening process is the same for OCS/NROTC/Academy I have seen people with 3.5 GPA in tech major get a "no" from the screeners.

3 section isn't just for Submariners, I have seen many times when the SWO-N JO's on the carrier were standing 3 section.

One other thing to remember is Admiral Donald is leaving in a few months, new Admiral means policies might be adjusted a bit.

 

[Renegade One]

And the beauty about going Naval Aviation? You can still become a "nuke" later in your career! You can thank USC Title 10 for that, I guess...