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UAVs, not just an Air Force gig anymore

Ducky

Formerly SNA2007
pilot
Contributor
Air-to-air is another story, but something even I doubt we will ever be faced with again.


Fleet guys feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but im sure the air to air war would be alive and well the moment we decided to fight a country with formidable air oponents, or any war in which we didn't immediately establish air superiority. I understand we have some badass BVR technology, but what about the times ROE requires a visual confirmation?
 

HeyJoe

Fly Navy! ...or USMC
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
I understand we have some badass BVR technology, but what about the times ROE requires a visual confirmation?

That's why we have AIM-9X and JHMCS

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MackOhare

New Member
The demand for UAVs with a finish capability is driven by elusive nature of a particular target set that favors a persistent overhead presence that a Pred or Reaper can fulfill. The advantages are still not all in favor of the UAS especially in CAS role. A surgical Time Critical Strike against an HVT like you referenced is not CAS, period. So just because it garners headlines doesn't mean the manned cockpit isn't better solution overhead troops in contact in need of CAS.

So your crystal ball is better than the legions of Air Force generals who laid it on the line for the F-22? Maybe you're right, but who thought we'd be in a land "war" in the other end of Asia even a year prior to Desert Storm and there was plenty of aerial combat. Many who thought like you did wish they'd hadn't as not all aircraft were optimized for it like the USAF F-15 Eagles were.

Excellent post heyjoe, and definitely appreciate the candor. Sorry for the frontlines quip, and also sorry for the tarmac line in an older post as well -- as a mere civilian, I'm not exactly up to snuff on my military jargon, and may have watched Band of Brothers one too many times. Sorry.:confused:

Nonetheless, I didn't mean to be disrespectful or claim to know what the future of warfare will definitely look like or not. If anything, I agree with you about the inability to guess what the future holds, and subsequently, I totally believe in the being-prepared-for-any/all-scenarios- approach to defense spending/planning. As far as China goes however, I will say that both the U.S. and China have their hands firmly placed into each others mouths and I'm willing to wager neither will ever bite.

I just find it an interesting time to be pursuing a career in military aviation, given the huge advances in technology we've seen over this past decade. Hell the cockpit of the F-35 looks like it came out of an Apple design lab! And it seems to me that the rate of change is accelerating as relates to aviation. The statistic about the AF training more UAV pilots than fighter/bomber pilots (obviously doesn't include cargo, tankers, helo, etc.) really scared me.

I've worked in the trading industry for the past 4 years. I started in the pits, and I've seen what happened to the guys who got left behind as trading moved to the screen (electronically). Today, most of the guys in the business ride the desk clicking their mouse instead of looking each other in the face. That's not to say there aren't still guys on the floor, because there are, but they are a much smaller, less important part of the overall machine. I'm one of the romantics who went down there because I wanted to be a part of the club -- its still exclusive, but its just a helluva lot smaller. That's what resonates when I think about this type of stuff, that's all. Probably been giving it too much thought, but then again, I'm unemployed now so I've got way too much time on my hands...
 

HeyJoe

Fly Navy! ...or USMC
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
What about when the commie hordes attack with 20 ship formations and you run out of missiles, need to switch to guns?

"Chesty" Puller liked those type of odds/situation at the Frozen Chosin. And yes, if you're out of missiles, there's always the gun, but engagements are rarely that simplistic.
 

a2b2c3

Mmmm Poundcake
pilot
Contributor
You know, someone once thought that we'd never need guns again on aircraft, that missiles would rule the sky and we'd never again fight in the visual arena... I think that person was wrong too...
 

A4sForever

BTDT OLD GUY
pilot
Contributor
Bottom line: after you add up all your hi-tech systems and missiles and radars -- when the balloon goes up and the chips are down ... >>> the 'real deal'<<< ... ????

GIVEN THE CHOICE: any USN pilot worth his 'salt' would LOVE to close to guns and get the kill ... it just wouldn't get any better than that ... :)
 

Uncle Fester

Robot Pimp
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
Bottom line: after you add up all your hi-tech systems and missiles and radars -- when the balloon goes up and the chips are down ... >>> the 'real deal'<<< ... ????

GIVEN THE CHOICE: any USN pilot worth his 'salt' would LOVE to close to guns and get the kill ... it just wouldn't get any better than that ... :)

Yessir. And whilest the square-jawed knights of the air are dueling with the wiley Asian Communist up at altitude in manly single combat, everyone else can worry about the hordes of cruise missiles and bombers on the deck trying to kill the Boat. Hell, that's why we have CIWS, right? :D
 

A4sForever

BTDT OLD GUY
pilot
Contributor
Yessir. And whilest the square-jawed knights of the air are dueling with the wiley Asian Communist up at altitude in manly single combat, everyone else can worry about the hordes of cruise missiles and bombers on the deck trying to kill the Boat. Hell, that's why we have CIWS, right? :D
I didn't know any "Asian Communists" ... but absent a land war, the ChiComs were kinda chump-change back then .... we considered them as 'targets', more than 'opponents' ... I actually thought I could 'survive' a SIOP target in China.

I gotta' tell you ... if the balloon had ever gone up w/ the Rooskies ... we figured we'd be cashin' in our frequent flyer miles as there wouldn't be a BOAT to come back to .... :eek:

Thaaaaa's why my B/N and I had an alternative plan: launch off USS BOAT, immediately jettison the nuke on safe, fly-by the ship and wave while steering a new course on our way south to our SIOP pre-planned 'secret' tropical isle stocked w/ beaucoup Mai'Tai's and hordes of hula-inclined wenches of da' best kine' .... :D


 

Uncle Fester

Robot Pimp
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
Thaaaaa's why my B/N and I had an alternative plan: launch off USS BOAT, immediately jettison the nuke on safe, fly-by the ship and wave while steering a new course on our way south to our SIOP pre-planned 'secret' tropical isle stocked w/ beaucoup Mai'Tai's and hordes of hula-inclined wenches of da' best kine' .... :D

Or, you get there and these guys are waiting for you:

medd_01_img0019.jpg
 
I read an article in the Washington Post this morning about UAV's, where the technology is headed and some of the issues they are having with them. It was a pretty interesting read and like stated in above comments talked about the % of AF pilots actually flying UAVs right now vs actual manned aircraft (big numbers). The article mentioned a platform that would allow for ~5yrs of nonstop flight, however a big problem it mentioned with that is advancing air defense capabilities and possiblities of higher numbers of downed UAVs. It was also noted at as the technology increases more issues are encountered with data transfer, which seems to be a common but fixable problem. Thought those were some interesting points from the article as well as it mentioning Air to Air combat in the future, as UAV's cannot account for the 360 degree awareness that the human brain allows for.
 

HeyJoe

Fly Navy! ...or USMC
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
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