Stupid Questions about Naval Aviation (Part 3)

[mad dog]

Regarding LSO gouge...thanks @nittany03, @MIDNJAC, @BigJeffray and @armada1651.

One more question regarding the LSO debriefs following the approaches/landings...do the debriefs consist of just a grade given or is there also instruction added as to how a specific approach/landing can be improved?

 

[ea6bflyr]

One more question regarding the LSO debriefs following the approaches/landings...do the debriefs consist of just a grade given or is there also instruction added as to how a specific approach/landing can be improved?

Nope, not from the debriefing LSO. It's "here's how I saw it, here's your final grade." There's an unwritten rule: No arguing with paddles; just say thank you and move on.

TINS: Flying with my cruise pilot (Me as ECMO1), he flies a rails pass. We confirm the rails pass on the VCR taped pass; high fives all the way around. Paddles comes in with "Blah, blah, blah, FLAT AT THE RAMP, FAIR 3 wire." Total BS and not anything we saw on the PLAT or experienced in the jet. My pilot bit his tongue, said 'thanks paddles' then proceeded to have a long discussion with our squadron paddles.

Most of the 'how to improve' post event comes from the squadron paddles either one-on-one, or in a group via squadron training; not from the de-briefing paddles.

BTW, boat grades during a line period have been know to kill a pilot's career. We had two dudes that never came back after COMPTUEX due to boat grades.

 

[armada1651]

Most of the 'how to improve' post event comes from the squadron paddles either one-on-one, or in a group via squadron training; not from the de-briefing paddles.

I don't think I'd agree with that entirely - the comments ARE the "how to improve," generally. As you alluded to, the debrief includes comments on deviations and corrections within the pass, followed by a grade. Squadron paddles and CAG paddles will also probably provide some training either to the ready room in an APM/AOM setting or one-on-one as required.

 

[Griz882]

How long ago was that? I can say I am currently a long way from my state line and travel several times a year outside AT. We do many missions active duty units don't do.

You are right, it was the "old days" and I am just having fun with the vast difference between the "weekend warrior" guard I first joined to the very much changed guard I deployed with and that we have today. But....I will say that (at least 5 years ago when I retired) air units get a lot more fun money than infantry units.

 

[Recovering LSO]

We confirm the rails pass on the VCR taped pass; high fives all the way around. Total BS and not anything we saw on the PLAT...

Ahhh, Plattles... Our favorite!

One thing to remember is that the LSO team sees upwards of 100 passes per day. CAG Paddles will see thousands of passes (waving every other day) during a cruise. Most pilots will see one, or two passes per day. Many CAG Paddles trend toward an attitude of "a happy airwing flies better," and most aren't out there trying to screw guys over with grades. At the same time, they need to hold a firm line on what is and is not "OK."

 

[Uncle Fester]

Ahhh, Plattles... Our favorite!

 

[Recovering LSO]

And if anyone who has not been on the boat for any extended period of time is interested in what it's "really like," check out this article....

I'm not sure they're going to be invited back.

 

[mad dog]

Speaking of LSOs...here are some LAMPS LSOs...I'm the one on the left. Does my butt look big in wash khakis?

From the bridge over the 1MC: "Hey you fucktard LSOs! Your bird is coming in...quit goofing off on the helo deck and get to the LSO shack!"

Fucktard LSOs: "Did that black shoe just call us 'fucktard LSOs' ???"

 

[Uncle Fester]

I'm not sure they're going to be invited back.

Didn't see an issue. Curious choice of lede, talking about a female sailor who doesn't quite get the concept of 'personal time' in berthing, but whatever. Point of the piece was how numbed you get to life on the Boat after a while, and that seemed to fit.

Shocked they talked to the VAW guys. Nobody ever interviews the Fat Kids.

 

[GroundPounder]

And if anyone who has not been on the boat for any extended period of time is interested in what it's "really like," check out this article....

I'm not sure they're going to be invited back.

Stupid administrative question; In the linked article is it likely that who ever approved them coming on board has a bad day or a really bad day? Does the person get told to do more research on the outlet and their probable slant on the story, or do they get roasted?

 

[Uncle Fester]

What am I missing that you guys think is so terrible about that article?

 

[jmcquate]

PBS "Carrier" (met Proton at the Oceana Air Show this year), and an episode of "This American Life" had their negative parts and as far as I know, the Navy was fine with it.

 

[Recovering LSO]

not the content per se, but the quality. it reads like something out of a high school newspaper. "the boat" went through quite a bit of work to get these "journalists" out there, and that's what they come up with?

 

[GroundPounder]

What am I missing that you guys think is so terrible about that article?

I don't think its horrible, and if my son wanted to join the Navy I would recommend it for background information. I was thinking along the lines that Big Navy would prefer articles that would be more likely to entice someone to join. No branch is ever as great as their advertising, and certainly not as bad as depicted by people that have decided they don't want to be there anymore.

In one of the scenes from the PBS series, they showed a guy mopping the head. He says something to the effect that " joining the Navy was the worst decision of his life, and the 2nd worst using his first paycheck to get this tattoo. " The PBS series, in my opinion, was balanced and had representation acorns the board. There were senior enlisted, the O corps, guys that planned to stay in for life, disgruntled dude.... Take that with a grain of salt from me, I was enlisted Infantry, and then branched Infantry when commissioned. The worst part of most service documentaries / articles is better than our best stuff.

 

[Uncle Fester]

I don't think its horrible, and if my son wanted to join the Navy I would recommend it for background information. I was thinking along the lines that Big Navy would prefer articles that would be more likely to entice someone to join. No branch is ever as great as their advertising, and certainly not as bad as depicted by people that have decided they don't want to be there anymore.

There was a point raised when the PBS Carrier series came out that a plain, unvarnished, un-spun account is probably going to appeal more to the targeted recruiting demographic these days, then a glossy recruiting commercial. "This is what it's really like on the Boat, warts and all."

And typically when it comes to the military approving this sort of thing, they don't care so much about glossiness. They have their own PR/recruiting guys for that. But they do want it shown that you'll suffer consequences for breaking rules. You'll notice for instance on Carrier that every sailor who fucked up, was shown being punished. The frat couple and underage drinker went to mast, the racist hick was kicked out of the Navy, etc.