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Navy Dedicated SAR Squadrons

Ventus

Weather Guesser
pilot
Chuck, I think part of the problem is you are equating HSC as the bulk or majority of what Navy helicopters do. We need the Sierras, as they're integral to the overall mission success, but there's a another huge portion of mission sets being executed by another Navy rotary community. It just seems like, to me, you just haven't taken the time to learn about it.



In large part because a lot of the successes that are occurring involve subjects that generally aren't discussed openly. The Houthi shoots were a fantastic win for HSM, but there's a lot of other important stuff they do that doesn't sound near as sexy.
Conversely I overheard someone describe SAR patterns as “doing the water roomba.”

I didn’t have a response for that.
 

DanMa1156

Is it baseball season yet?
pilot
Contributor
Everyone talked about HSC CVW as just being PG.

I can count on my fingers the number of times I was actually just Plane Guard and not conducting operational Log, ISR, SSC, or even just ACTC training for a younger guy.


Conversely I overheard someone describe SAR patterns as “doing the water roomba.”

I didn’t have a response for that.
 

SynixMan

HKG Based Artificial Excrement Pilot
pilot
Contributor
Which would lead me to believe that strike planners would set up a designated FARP somewhere that is feet-dry and stage a few MH-60S there.


However, if it got to this, the USAF or USMC package might be the better candidate, depending on Time/Speed/Distance from the problem. DDG or other ship as a "Lilly pad" was always our first go to since it was in the CFMCC's chain of command.

Or just base them in theater. I have a buddy who deployed to Iraq doing CSAR and CASEVAC in the 60S.

Erbil in 2016ish? IIRC, this was a one off thing some enterprising JO's got resourced at the Pentagon. The Flags that be proclaimed "never again" as it was a huge expense in money/logistics vs steady state ops off the boat. CNAF said that at the NHA symposium.

From talking to a buddy who works for JPRA a couple of years age. He said Navy CSAR is limited by the lack of in air refueling capabilities.

See above. Multiple options but the Navy's primary advantage wrt to CSAR is the world is 70% water, we have boats with helicopters and swimmers fucking everywhere, and the nearest USAF Det or USMC MEU/ACE/ARG/whatever they're calling themselves now might be far out. Going to a multi-service staff and playing in NATO stuff was kind of eye opening with regards to the scale Uncle Sam plays at.
 

lowflier03

So no $hit there I was
pilot
Erbil in 2016ish? IIRC, this was a one off thing some enterprising JO's got resourced at the Pentagon. The Flags that be proclaimed "never again" as it was a huge expense in money/logistics vs steady state ops off the boat. CNAF said that at the NHA symposium.
Not JO's, CENTCOM. The USAF RQS community was maxed out after constant deployments and there was a gap in coverage. Ultimately SECDEF had to step in and order the Navy to do our part and we complied. But you are correct in that the Navy immediately claimed it would never happen again. Not due to Money/Logistics but because "we didn't buy these aircraft to risk losing them over land" (Heard that from 2 separate AIRBOSSes)
 

Hair Warrior

Well-Known Member
Contributor
Not JO's, CENTCOM. The USAF RQS community was maxed out after constant deployments and there was a gap in coverage. Ultimately SECDEF had to step in and order the Navy to do our part and we complied. But you are correct in that the Navy immediately claimed it would never happen again. Not due to Money/Logistics but because "we didn't buy these aircraft to risk losing them over land" (Heard that from 2 separate AIRBOSSes)
Oh the irony, given how the Navy has used reservists to fill IA mobs for the past 20 years. Apples and oranges, obviously, but still humorous in a way.
 

hscs

Registered User
pilot
See above. Multiple options but the Navy's primary advantage wrt to CSAR is the world is 70% water, we have boats with helicopters and swimmers fucking everywhere, and the nearest USAF Det or USMC MEU/ACE/ARG/whatever they're calling themselves now might be far out. Going to a multi-service staff and playing in NATO stuff was kind of eye opening with regards to the scale Uncle Sam plays at.
And those USAF assets need runways….
 

sevenhelmet

Low calorie attack from the Heartland
pilot
…..”General, I just need you to confirm that this is tasking? Oh it is? Yes sir, we will give you whatever you want, I just extended all our guys for 365 days and two Christmasses”
“Not good enough. When you do get home, two years from now, I need you to remain in surge status, and we’ll have a FLAILEX and a CLUSTER right away. All post-deployment POM is canceled. All your guys will be exci- hey, why is everyone leaving?”
 

DanMa1156

Is it baseball season yet?
pilot
Contributor
“Not good enough. When you do get home, two years from now, I need you to remain in surge status, and we’ll have a FLAILEX and a CLUSTER right away. All post-deployment POM is canceled. All your guys will be exci- hey, why is everyone leaving?”
Umm… you joke… but I’ve been in a VTC during COVID times where a 4 Star was lambasting 3 stars over not controlling COVID hard enough while also demanding to know why retention was low.

At one point the 4 star threatened to order squadrons to make bunks in the hangar bays and not allow their people to go home, all in the same conversation.
 

sevenhelmet

Low calorie attack from the Heartland
pilot
Umm… you joke… but I’ve been in a VTC during COVID times where a 4 Star was lambasting 3 stars over not controlling COVID hard enough while also demanding to know why retention was low.

At one point the 4 star threatened to order squadrons to make bunks in the hangar bays and not allow their people to go home, all in the same conversation.
Name and shame. That kind of behavior deserves to be called out. I have a couple of ideas who this might have been.
 

ea6bflyr

Working Class Bum
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
Umm… you joke… but I’ve been in a VTC during COVID times where a 4 Star was lambasting 3 stars over not controlling COVID hard enough while also demanding to know why retention was low.

At one point the 4 star threatened to order squadrons to make bunks in the hangar bays and not allow their people to go home, all in the same conversation.
That dude should retire and shouldn’t be a 4-star….
 
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