Military Aviation vs. Civilian Aviation

[AllenAzali]

I just passed the ASTB with mostly 7's. I'm hoping to go to OCS after graduation, and plan on staying in the Navy for the minimum required amount. I believe thats one tour at sea and one tour on a base.
My question is, how does military training look on a resume when applying for a civilian job in aviation? How different are the flying practices, such as taking off and landing, and signals given to the radio control tower. I'm sure there are some flying ettiqates (et-tick-kates) that are different between the two, but how do they compare? Is there alot of respect given to military pilots in the private industry? Does a military pilot's license even transfer over into civilian airports? What about jobs for commercial airliners, how do they look at pilots who have gone through military training?

 

[Raptor2216]

hey dude, I don't mean to sound like an
a-hole but if you are going into the military for the sole purpose of getting an airline job later on, then you are making a big mistake. 10 years may not seem like much but well it's 10 years. If I were you, i'd think it over.

 

[AllenAzali]

Its not just to get an airliner job...I want to get into the military, first to serve. But I don't want to make it into a lifetime career. 10 years of my life is worth the honor of flying for the military...I just want to know how the education and experience is reguarded in a professional standpoint, and plus I want to know if I have something going for me after.

 

[Grunt]

I can't answer your question, but make sure you don't let anyone else in the service know that it is your intention to break away after 10 years. You'll become a veritable pariah if you do. Just my $0.02.



Mike the Grunt

 

[Jeff29]

Just a few comments:

1. I know that when transferring from a regional to Delta, they like to see 5000 hours, but they will take someone from the military with only 3000 hours.

2. My understanding is that you will likely do part of a second sea tour before your time is up.

3. 40% of Navy pilots fly helicopters -- makes it harder to get to the airlines without a lot of extra work on your part.

 

[aviatorshade]

It didn't sound like criticism to me at all. I would have raised the same concerns as Raptor after Azali's first post. There are definite right and wrong reasons for joining the military and comments like "plan on staying in the Navy for the minimum required amount" should cause some concern. The United States military is a place for willing warriors and selfless leaders. G.I. bills, bonuses, and training are rewards and thank you's from a grateful Nation. They should not be your primary reasons for electing to serve. I believe Azali's second post made clear his intentions to serve with honor.

Semper Fidelis

 

[AllenAzali]

I just wanted to post this from Los Angeles County. Theyre hiring a helo pilot for fire services.

SELECTION REQUIREMENTS:
Training and Experience:Four thousand logged hours of flying time in helicopters as Aircraft Commander (AC). (A maximum of five hundred hours of Flight Instructor time will be allowed to meet the four thousand hours of Aircraft Commander time required). Fifteen hundred hours of this time must have been flown in mountainous terrain, at pressure altitudes (PA) of over 4,000 feet on map survey work, power line patrol or construction work, fire control work, rescue operations work, or similar assignments requiring take-off and landings with maximum loads on unimproved landing areas under adverse weather conditions.

LICENSE:
1) A commercial pilot’s certificate issued by the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) with rotorcraft - helicopter rating (Foreign applicants must have equivalent to FAA certificate, and have FAA certificate prior to employment)

Thats what I'm hoping serving in the military will cover.

Am I the only person who wants to be a "Ghetto Bird?" (Flying a helo for the Police Department)

Plus I gotta raise my son so that he can play in the Major League.

 

[Mahler]

One thing that I've noticed is a serious lack of interest in discussing helos with guys heading off to flight school, or most pilots in general. It's almost like talking about helos is uncool or something when you can be talking about fighters instead. I have yet to figure it out. Most of the people that I hear saying helos are lame have never even been in one. I, for one, think helos would be a blast to fly and wouldn't be dissapointed if I get selected for them. I don't know much about police flying other than they're always flying at the edge of the deadman's curve. I know a lot of agencies take street cops and put them through flight training, while others have a contracted pilot in the right seat and an officer in the left.

As for weather to go military or not, I'd say it depends on weather or not you have an interest in being in the military in the first place. If you do, I'd definitally go in and let the government pay for ratings, because helocopters are so damn expensive to take lessons with. If military life might be for you, then you have to decide which service. Do you think it would be cool to live on a ship and travel overseas??? Then go Navy or Marines. If you want all that mountain flying for the forestry service then Army might be the way to go. And if you want cushy quarters and a 9-5, monday thru friday schedule, then join the Air Force In any case, it sounds like you have a lot of desicions to make. I'll let you get started....

James

 

[Raptor2216]

Since we are talking about helos, what kind of jobs are out there for ex-military helo pilots? Do they pay well? I'm going into the Marines knowing the fact that they mostly fly helo's I am a little concerned about finding a good enough job flying helo's in the civilian world. I'm doing engineering right now so that I have something to fall back on but I doubt that any company will hire me when I have no past experience under my belt in that field. If I could have it my way, I would never stop flying but well you never know what might happen in the future. So, if some of you have some advice then i'd like to hear it. Thanks.



Edited by - raptor2216 on 02/27/2002 21:32:08

 

[Steve Wilkins]

Or......just count your losses, go SWO, and drive ships instead.

Steve Wilkins

 

[psu_midn]

Sea-sick
...Hmmmm....Navy....water....aircraft carriers....ships...water......HMMMMMMM

 

[Dave Shutter]

Settle down now...

 

[Frumby]

Well let me stick my nose into this one. My initial intention was to retire from active duty but things in life and my priorities plus sick of the past 8 years with a JACKASS in the White House changed. I decided to try my hand at civilian life. It was a tough choice especially since I had made Major in under 10 years and was in a senior leadership billet after 12 years. When I jumped ship, I already had my commercial rating. After I got my wings, I went down to the local FSDO in San Antonio and took a 50 question test. (Of course, I had the gouge). I never had flown a civilian plane in my life but this test gave me a commercial license. I paid out of my own pocket to get Type Rated in the 737 and the applied to 3 airlines, United, American and Southwest. Delta wasn't hiring and I never considered being a vampire (UPS, FEDEX). I was hired at all 3. Did I mention that I had only 1550 hours total time upon hiring? 8 years of Clinton hurt pilots but my military experience was considered and I got hired. Things are different in the civilain world but easily adaptable. You will benefit from military training in ANY job you seek. Military pilots are snapped up in nonflying jobs (Tech, stock broker, banks to name a few of my friends professions)because they are pilots. They can adapt and overcome and succeed and will win at any cost. Corporate america loves that determination. The fact that your a pilot also is a great icebreaker in many social buisness gatherings. My point is that there is much more then flying available to any one who served whether a pilot or not. The greatest advantage of being a military pilot over a civilian is that few civilians have ever pushed their aircraft to the limits. Military pilots train almost daily on the limits. Every military pilot, regardless of airframe, has flown inverted, spinned, stalled and recovered from unusual attitudes which very few civilian pilots have ever done. Civilians do know the FAR's and that's where military pilots lack but you catch up pretty quick. The hardest thing for a military pilot in the civilain world is not be a prick! The civilian counterpart worked just as hard, maybe harder when you consider he paid for all his training and got a starting job at 14,000/year. Respect the civilians because your in their world and they can teach a military guy to survive without getting violated. I hope that helps. Oh one last point, there is not an airline in buisness today that starts its FO's at $80+. $40 yes but not 80. Good luck. Frumby

Attack Pilot
Major USMC

 

[Mahler]

Frumby,
Are the starting salaries for ex-military pilots the same for everyone else for the big airlines???

AllaenAzali,

Yesterday we had Career Expo at my University and the Army brought up one of their Blackhawks again. I got to check it out and sit in the right seat. I'm 6'4", and after pushing the pedals all the way forward and the seat all the way back and down, I still filled out that cockpit pretty well. Oh, and the OH=58 (Jet Ranger) was even a tighter squeeze. One day I'd like to figure out why all aircraft designers think that all pilots are shorter than 5'10".


James

 

[Frumby]

That's maybe what the media says but I can tell you with great confidence that when I got hired, SWA paid the highest for first year pilots, 35K to be exact. After UAL, AMR and Delta signed their new contracts, first year pilots moved from 24k, 22k and 26K, respectively, to just at 40K. Military or civiian pilot, it doesn't make a difference in pay. You get 1st year pay and thats it! 2nd and 3rd year pay is when it starts getting good. Food for thought. Frumby

Attack Pilot
Major USMC

Edited by - frumby on 03/02/2002 16:08:01