Math and Physics

[Airboss2B]

Sorry if this has already been covered but is it necessary to have exceptional skills in math and physics to become a pilot?

I'm active duty finishing up my degree in Management studies (not particularly strong in M & P) and am hoping to get picked up for OCS. I was wondering what I would need to bone up on if I got accepted.

Also, is age much of a factor for flight training (I'm 28)? Thanks

 

[Dave Shutter]

Airboss2b...

I asked a Primary instructor pilot at an air show that exact question and he told me I'd be taught everything I need to know and that the hardest math I'd probably ever do would be on the entrance test!

I'm in the same boat as you, about to finish my application for OCS. You'd have to ask John or Matt how much "M & P" you do on a day to day as an actual pilot, (I took some private lessons and you need make calculations for load, fuel and distances but that's just the basics) but if your like me and not strong at remembering formulas and number crunching then the ASTB might give you some trouble. I don't know if you know this already, but taking a test called the Navy/MC Aviation Selection Test Battery, is the first step in getting to OCS. Your coming from active duty so I imagine your application process is a little different, but I'm sure you still have to take this test.

The first hurdle is the Math/Verbal test, 37 question in 35 minutes. It's about 70-80% math really, mostly word problems ranging from general math to geometry and even algebra, and some paragraph comrehension questions.

Wait...it gets better. This test is followed by the not quite as sinister Mechanical Comprehension test. Material covered ranges from electronics, mechanics, measuring devices, tool recognition and some lever and fulcrum problems (which also use equations)to name a few.

Together your score on these two tests make up your OAR (Officer Aptitude Rating) which determines if you are eligible to be an Officer. To screen for pilot you have to take the second part of the test which is the aviation part; comprised of the SAT: Spacial Aperation Test (look at pictures of a plane in flight and pick a corresponding POV pic), the Aviation/Nautical Information Test (answer basic questions about aviation and boating, testing your know-how) and the Biographical Information Test (general personal info and personality questions, there are no right or wrong answers, they're looking for a type).

We did discuss this topic ad'nauseum a few months ago, and I thought these above were the only tests, but ENS. Wilkins said there was a fourth test in the aviation part but I can't recall what, I think he called it the the Aviation Interest test, or something. John/Steve???

My study guides are a few years old so the aviation part of the test may very well have been changed or added too. See a career counselor or recruiter? I don't know which applies to you.

My advice: get the Arco study guides, one titled "Officer Candidate Tests" and the "Military Flight Aptitude Tests" as well. It's probably the same advice you'll get from your career couselor or whoever it is you have to see. Also, if your like me and have big trouble with word problems then get another Arco book titled "How to Solve Algebra Word Problems", Page after page contains word problems identical to the ones on the test and it comes with solid explanations wheras the others tend to give you these huge word problems and then whip these insane formulas out of nowhere. the "...Word Problem" book goes through the process step by step and helps you to learn it better, I think.

[/i]Boy, Arco should pay me![/i]

As for age: I'm 28 also and with prior service and I can apply as late as 29, IE: finish OCS and start API before 29'th b-day. But recently (according to recruiter)it's been hiked to 31 but that's probably very temporary, a lot of slots coming this Oct!

Best of luck!

D

Edited by - Dave Shutter on 08/29/2000 20:49:56

 

[Dave Shutter]

I forgot...

If all these tests come across to you as less than pleasent, look on the bright side, you could be testing for the Air Force: their two tests have twenty three parts and takes about six hours!!!

...have fun studying for that one.

FLY NAVY!

D

 

[Airboss2B]

Great info Dave. Thanks. I'm just starting to put my package together. My final day of class is 23 Sep. I'll probably take the OAR and ASTB around the beginning of december( sooner if I think I'm ready). This gives me a little time to prepare for a higher score. I picked up the Arco book for the OCT but I still need to get the MFAT. I also want to check out the one on word problems. If there's anything else you can remeber about the tests, I'll take all the help I can get.

I'll be 29 in April which will probably be before I would ship out to OCS if accepted. Sure hope that age waiver is still in effect.


Good luck on your package! I hope you get accepted. Maybe we'll share some airspace someday.

 

[Dave Shutter]

Dave here agan...

I turn 29 in June, so I have a comfortable little window, but my waivers will take time and I don't want to sit on them. I have pushed back my test date a couple of times now because I knew I just wasn't ready, but I figure it's now or never. If you know you won't get out of OCS before your 29, then you'll definately need the "alleged" new age increase of 31 for prior's. Ask your programs rep about it, mine may be full of BS.

As for waiting, I was thinking about Navy when I graduated in the summer of 98' and by the time I was serious enough to go to a recruiters office it was Nov. and all the pilot slots for the FY had already come out and were gone! He said to check back the following summer to get ready for the next Oct. rollout. I had to wait a year! By the following summer my knee was acting up and I knew something was seriously wrong. Fixing it took up another year! If you want to wait till Dec. to study that's cool, but I'm not so sure about the new 31 age max. As a matter of fact my recruiter said he only heard it from someone else, so that doubles the odds it's BS. I would have my rep look it up for sure if I were you, and don't take it from me. Even if it's true, the new "31" reg may not be around come April, The Navy changes reg's like socks, especially if a lot of SNA slots get filled this Oct. If not then you have to be a OCS grad with orders to API before you're 29 or else you might not get pilot.

FYI: the 29/w/prior age limit in itself is not concrete, you must apply for it via BUPERS. Due to low recruiting you'll probably get in from what I've heard, but again you may not!

As for sharing airspace, nice thought, real nice but brother all I'm thinking about right now is passing the test, the physical, the PRT and getting to P-Cola and surviving those USMC Drill Sergeants!

Best of luck with your package and keep in touch! Maybe we'll hit OCS together, then I won't feel so old among all the kiddies. We'll stick out with our prior ribbons though!

D





Edited by - Dave Shutter on 08/29/2000 22:28:56

 

[Eagle1]

Airboss2B:
Hopefully this makes you feel a bit better about Math and Physics: I recently graduated with a double major in history and political science. The last time I took either a math or physics course was during my junior year in high school, 1994. This past fall I bought the Arco Guide to Officer Candidate Tests, studied it, and passed the ATSB. All of the geometrical formulas are given to you during the ATSB- they are printed at the top of the test booklet. You simply need to figure out how to plug the numbers into the equations. My advice: first, do all of the ones (both math and verbal) that you understand, and don't get bogged down on the difficult ones. You don't need to answer all of them; just answer correctly the ones that you choose to answer.
Also, purchase and study the Arco Military Flight Aptitude Test book, particulary, the section concerning spatial perception. These questions are not difficult. However, they take time to answer, and since this section is especially time intensive the more that you prepare ahead of time the better you perform. I didn't purchase the book, and consequently I struggled through this part of the test as I tred to read, analyze, and understand it at the same time that I tried to answer it during the allotted time. I barely passed.
Best of luck, and, anyone in the 1 OCT OCS class please drop me a line.

JF

 

[webmaster]

Airboss, I wouldn't worry to much about the math/physics side of things. Any of the math that we do is pretty basic, and any that you do in the plane is mostly your ability to do quick calculations. Yesterday for instance I was flying with an instructor who liked to ask you what your Visual Descent Point was, so while flying the approach I had to quickly spit out the answers for both DME and Timing, basically just doing some division in your head, and rounding numbers to make it easier for yourself. But for the academic portion, the most complicated you get is filling out a flight plan and fuel log, which is just a bunch of addition. So in the end, I don't think that is going to effect you adversely if you are a rocket scientist with math and physics.

Also, we had some other information on another post about the test:

http://www.airwarriors.com/cgi-bin/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=29&FORUM_ID=4&CAT_ID=1&Topic_Title=officer+test+question%3F&Forum_Title=Military+Aviation+in+General

And yes Dave, there is a portion on Aviation Interest. Side note, after readig all these posts this morning Dave, you sound like a broken down old man!! But I hear you on the kiddies portion, here I am with a wife and two kids (6 and 8), how do you think that makes me feel next to all these guys/gals straight out of college, feeling old again...

Eagle1, check your profile and update your email address. The one you entered got returned from your email server.

quote:
An e-mail address you specified as a recipient in the message returned
below is not a valid entry in Boston University's directory.

penhij@bu.edu

 

[Airboss2B]

quote:
We'll stick out with our prior ribbons though!

Yeah, that should to be good for an extra 1,000 pushups.

 

[Dave Shutter]

DAMN!!! That reminds me, I was down at the Rec' station today and a new Ens. fresh from OCS was...get this...PRIOR SERVICE ARMY, AND ALSO MY AGE! Freaked me out, As soon as I got in my car I thought to ask him about his DI's abuse: not only was he a prior, but ARMY!

...maybe this OCS thing isn't such a good idea?

Oh well, least I don't feel like such a freak anymore.

D