Marine Corps Replacing M249 SAW - H&K IAR Winner

[HueyCobra8151]

Oh man, how are we going to put the enemy into the HORNS OF A DILEMMA by employing -203s in the deadspace and grazing fire from the SAW?

What ELSE did TBS lie to me about?

BTW that dude from Future Weapons is such a major homo...why does he act like there aren't 200 round drums or 100 round bags we use? He carries the rounds hanging loose like an idiot - they aren't contact rounds like a 240 or something...

Edit: Guess that clip posted doesn't show it, on the full episode he wanders around some fake combat town w/ a SAW looking like a tool shed.

 

[statesman]

So H&K finally got their US armed forces contract. They have been wanting a major contract for a very very long time. Still not the XM8 I'm sure they were wanting.

 

[statesman]

Guess that clip posted doesn't show it, on the full episode he wanders around some fake combat town w/ a SAW being a tool shed.

Fixed it for you.

I hate that guy as well. He is WAY too dramatic, and takes every opportunity he gets to remind you that he was a SEAL.

Favorite Quote from that clip:

"This weapon was designed to work!

Well no $h17! It's a good thing the USMC picked a weapon designed to work... you know, as opposed to all those weapons that were competing for the contract which were designed to NOT work... what foresight.

2 above for headwork USMC.

I hate Future Weapons.

 

[Swanee]

Oh man, how are we going to put the enemy into the HORNS OF A DILEMMA by employing -203s in the deadspace and grazing fire from the SAW?

What ELSE did TBS lie to me about?

BTW that dude from Future Weapons is such a major homo...why does he act like there aren't 200 round drums or 100 round bags we use? He carries the rounds hanging loose like an idiot - they aren't contact rounds like a 240 or something...

Edit: Guess that clip posted doesn't show it, on the full episode he wanders around some fake combat town w/ a SAW looking like a tool shed.

Yes, but could you really get effective grazing fire rates from the SAW? I couldn't count the times I had to damn re-rack the thing only to get one round off. In my fire team I think we maybe went through 2 complete drums for the entire 6 months.

 

[Pepe]

Yes, but could you really get effective grazing fire rates from the SAW? I couldn't count the times I had to damn re-rack the thing only to get one round off. In my fire team I think we maybe went through 2 complete drums for the entire 6 months.

You fed the belt in upside down...

 

[HueyCobra8151]

Yes, but could you really get effective grazing fire rates from the SAW? I couldn't count the times I had to damn re-rack the thing only to get one round off. In my fire team I think we maybe went through 2 complete drums for the entire 6 months.

MGs should be relatively reliable if you keep them lubed up (remembering that CLP takes 2 hours to reach peak lubrication level). Once I broke down and paid for a can of CLP and gave mine a good spray every morning out in the field I never had any issues with it. I fired over 800 rounds in one day during MOUT, and the other 2 in my squad fired 1000 and 600 respectively.

The SAW is definitely not as bullet-proof as the 240 or the M2 though.

I definitely like the fact that the IAR fires the first shot closed bolt and then goes to open bolt afterwards, that right there should make it MUCH more reliable.

 

[Swanee]

MGs should be relatively reliable if you keep them lubed up (remembering that CLP takes 2 hours to reach peak lubrication level). Once I broke down and paid for a can of CLP and gave mine a good spray every morning out in the field I never had any issues with it. I fired over 800 rounds in one day during MOUT, and the other 2 in my squad fired 1000 and 600 respectively.

The SAW is definitely not as bullet-proof as the 240 or the M2 though.

I definitely like the fact that the IAR fires the first shot closed bolt and then goes to open bolt afterwards, that right there should make it MUCH more reliable.

We had gas tube issues, it was lubed more than my prom date but it wouldn't be reliable. The armory kept taking it and saying they fixed it, and it would work for all of 20 rounds or so...

 

[raptor10]

Defense review has an interesting take on the competition, apparently we could have received the same capability for a lot cheaper; also a disturbing ttp that explains the idea behind an iar.

defensereview.com/us-marine-corps-selects-hk-iar-infantry-automatic-rifle-as-replacement-for-fn-m249-sawlmg/

 

[nittany03]

Squid question for those going on about 100-200rd mags. I read somewhere that C-Mags were tried in Afghanistan, and rejected due to reliability issues including failures to feed, and the big huge mag putting undue stress on the mag well. Are there other designs out there too?

Certainly not mall-ninja enough to buy one, just curious.

 

[Lawman]

Squid question for those going on about 100-200rd mags. I read somewhere that C-Mags were tried in Afghanistan, and rejected due to reliability issues including failures to feed, and the big huge mag putting undue stress on the mag well. Are there other designs out there too?

Certainly not mall-ninja enough to buy one, just curious.

Beta mags work. Certainly as well and reliably as military M16/4 mags that have been unloaded and reloaded however many thousand times in their lives.

When the Marines first got the SAW, they didnt send any belted Ammunition with it to Lejeune. They were using belted ammo out at Pendelton. The difference in general impression with the weapon was amazing. My uncle told me stories about him being at Lejeune and watching Marines literally walking down the line with a bucket full of CLP and a paintbrush to constantly lube the weapons. The blame went on the weapon when after a good bit of time they realized it was the Magazine that was causing the issues. Problem is they didnt take those mags out of circulation because there wasnt money to buy new ones. There is a great example of fixing the symptoms but not the problems in the military. Think about it, how many times have you finished up at a range and spent half the afternoon trying to clean a rifle only to have the armorer hand it back to you for dirt/carbon you couldnt even see.... Now how many times have you serviced a magazine.

 

[HueyCobra8151]

Defense review has an interesting take on the competition, apparently we could have received the same capability for a lot cheaper; also a disturbing ttp that explains the idea behind an iar.

defensereview.com/us-marine-corps-selects-hk-iar-infantry-automatic-rifle-as-replacement-for-fn-m249-sawlmg/

Hmmmm...at first they talk about how it is a great idea because the IAR "camouflages" who has the automatic weapon within the fireteam from the enemy...then they go on to talk about all the giant magazines they are going to put on it - thereby rendering said camouflage moot.

Swanee: Yeah, getting the armory to make any minor fix to the SAW was like pulling teeth. I understand they are busy, but a weapon shouldn't be yellow-tagged for 6 months straight...Ridiculous.

 

[ryan1234]

Anyone know how this is working out?

SA80A2 LSW

http://www.army.mod.uk/equipment/support-weapons/1461.aspx

 

[Pepe]

Anyone know how this is working out?

SA80A2 LSW

http://www.army.mod.uk/equipment/support-weapons/1461.aspx

That ".uk" part of the address means it's in the UK.

 

[ryan1234]

That ".uk" part of the address means it's in the UK.

Well Detective Pepe..... the reason I ask is because when HK was part of BAE in the mid to late 90s, they took the SA80A1 and refurbed it into the A2 because of general reliability issues... the LSW was part of the SA80 familiy.. so it got re-worked too. The idea of the LSW was to have the basic infantry weapon with a heavier barrel... and I guess even capable from firing from the open bolt(?). So in some respects the LSW is like the HK IAR, with the same 30rd magazine and a one time barrel.

 

[Pepe]

Well Detective Pepe..... the reason I ask is because when HK was part of BAE in the mid to late 90s, they took the SA80A1 and refurbed it into the A2 because of general reliability issues... the LSW was part of the SA80 familiy.. so it got re-worked too. The idea of the LSW was to have the basic infantry weapon with a heavier barrel... and I guess even capable from firing from the open bolt(?). So in some respects the LSW is like the HK IAR, with the same 30rd magazine and a one time barrel.

Ok, I see where you're coming from now. I didn't see the correlation at first. My bad.