• Please take a moment and update your account profile. If you have an updated account profile with basic information on why you are on Air Warriors it will help other people respond to your posts. How do you update your profile you ask?

    Go here:

    Edit Account Details and Profile

Looking for gouge? Ask your Stupid Questions about Naval Aviation here (Part 1)

Status
Not open for further replies.

Uncle Fester

Robot Pimp
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
In that light -- i.e., "the Navy would need big nuke-delivering airplanes" -- you gotta remember the genesis of this little beauty -- as one of it's rationales was to serve as a semi-expendable "one-way" nuke delivery platform in addition to replacing the venerable A-1 SPAD

One of the real beauties of the Scooter was that the original concept was for a huge monster of an airplane. Ed Heinemann came up with the Bantam Bomber instead, just 'cuz he could; as things happened, it was coincident with a revolution in computer/electronics miniaturization that allowed nukes to get smaller and smaller. So the Navy told Saint Ed, "yeah, man, run with your little airplane deal". Just to hedge bets, they built the Whale as well. It was the spirit of the age. Can you imagine such a thing happening now? DoD puts out a Request for Proposals and a major defense contractor comes back with, "Here's something completely opposite of what you asked for, but it'll do the job."

Just to illustrate how desperate the Navy was to keep in the Nuke game, during the same period (mid-50's) they also developed the P6M Seamaster Heavy Attack jet seaplane - one way to get into the intercontinental bomber game, since anything with the lift and range would be too huge for flying off the Boat.

p6m-3.jpg


The period of about 1946-1964 is really fascinating - this perfect mix of rapidly advancing technology and a shitload of money. Kind of the same cool-gadgets thing that's happening nowadays with cel phones and mp3 players, but with toys that can kill lots of people.
 

HuggyU2

Well-Known Member
None
When they introduce new platforms, and the new ones are completely different animals than the old ones, who gets to be the first ones to train on them?
Is it the experienced guys who are already expert pilots?
Or is it the fresh nuggets that aren't set in the ways of the old platforms?
Depends, I suppose, but in the case of the F-22, there are at least 3 squadrons flying now, and the first student out of pilot training to go to the F-22 still hasn't gone to training yet.
 

BACONATOR

Well-Known Member
pilot
Contributor
@Heyjoe: Thanks for the detailed explanation. I thought I'd ask since I don't know sh!t about the process and of course the thread title is appropriate.
 

HeyJoe

Fly Navy! ...or USMC
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
@Heyjoe: Thanks for the detailed explanation. I thought I'd ask since I don't know sh!t about the process and of course the thread title is appropriate.

I didn't know that much about it until I got involved in RDT&E directly and started teaching the Req, Acq and PPBE processes and how they interrelate (as well as who's who).
 

FLYTPAY

Pro-Rec Fighter Pilot
pilot
None
I heard that for the new P-8, they are selecting P-3 pilots to go to Pax river to be the test pilots to transition the syllabus to the P-8. Is this type of process just for transition aircraft or does this apply to completely new airframes?
They should just send them to Higher Power!:D
 

corvairdroptop

Registered User
One of the problems of that first cruise was that most all of the officers had been the top performer at their previous command. That and very many were also up for their department head tour – way too many for the too few department heads available for them. The two nuggets used to shake their heads as the more senior officers stepped all over each other in bloody competition for top fitness reports and DH billets.

Heard that exact complaint from a couple of F-22 officers who had made the transition from F-15. Given their years in service, I would think that the stakes are higher and the competition is increased. They also noted that each guy seems to have a star in his corner, making it even worse.

Also, new squadrons may not take delivery of airframes on schedule, meaning unpredictable log time and a surplus of pilots, many of whom were considered to be top performers.

In the room at the same time was a guy who had made the switch from F-4 to F-15 during its introduction. He chimed in -- the more things change...
 

FLYTPAY

Pro-Rec Fighter Pilot
pilot
None
Sea Donkey is the nickname for Sea Dragon missions. I've never done them, so someone else can explain it.
Operation Sea Dragon II was devised to discourage and interdict terrorist activities in the Arabian Gulf. While surface assets would board suspect vessels either for cause or randomly, air assets would provide a MAS (like CAS over water) presence to protect legit vessels and GOPLATS (gas and oil platforms and fields). The reason we call it Sea Donkey is because it is often time boring and repititious and has no glory in it. Senior guys....please chime in and give Sea Dragon I experiences
 

ea6bflyr

Working Class Bum
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
Great Thread....NOSE!

Orange Flight Suits: Saw them when I was on the Big E (Big Enema) back in the 80s when VF-114 (Aardvarks) wore them all the time.

Sea Donkey: Pretty much very boring SSC in the gulf.

-ea6bflyr ;)
 

Nose

Well-Known Member
pilot
Heyjoe- you said "OPTEVFOR" and I threw up in my mouth. A lot.



Fester: great post!

Can you imagine such a thing happening now? DoD puts out a Request for Proposals and a major defense contractor comes back with, "Here's something completely opposite of what you asked for, but it'll do the job."

Yeah, nowadays it's more like "Here is exactly what you asked for, and it pretty much comes up short in every mission area, but you will buy it anyway."

PS "Lets call it 'The Hornet'"
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top